Analysis Breaking Exclusive

Exclusive: amid £5m loss, Labour boosts cash for ‘senior management’ by 65%

Party management costs went down under Corbyn. Under Starmer and sidekick Evans, they’ve rocketed

Yesterday, the dire state of the Labour party under Keir Starmer and his general secretary David Evans hit the headlines as the party posted a financial loss of almost £5 million – which would have been much worse had the pension fund not returned a large surplus – and notified the Electoral Commission of the loss of 91,000 members in a single year.

But an eagle-eyed Skwawkbox reader also spotted that, amid the disappearance of huge amounts of cash down the drain, the party’s payments for ‘senior management’ had shot up by an eye-watering 65%, from £533,000 to £880,000.

Page 17, note 11 of the party’s accounts reads:

Key management personnel of the Party are members of the senior management and the total employment benefits of that group [for the 2021 financial year] was £880,000 (2020: £533,000).”

In sharp contrast, overall party staff numbers as of 31 Dec 2021 had fallen – from 424 to 331.

The staggering rise also contrasts with spending on ‘key management personnel’ under Jeremy Corbyn and then-general secretary Jennie Formby, which went down in 2018 and 2019, despite fighting a general election:

2014: £440k
2015: £530k
2016: £561k
2017: £584k
2018: £571k
2019: £485k
2020: £533k
2021: £880k

Corbyn also left the party with a huge and increased surplus.

The report does not give the number of “key management personnel”, so it’s possible that Starmer and Evans have increased the number of managers, but a rise of 65% in a single year appears to be unprecedented.

Either way, for the party to be increasing spending on its ‘fat cats’ as it loses £5m – in the same year as sacking community organisers and cutting other roles – and denying support to workers striking for even a cost of living increase during the cost-of-corporate-greed crisis – ought to be remarkable. That it’s somehow unsurprising speaks volumes about what Labour has become under Keir Starmer.

Labour has been contacted for comment.

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      1. Thanks BP, ‘massive rise in staff payments’ AND a massive fall in staff numbers. Starmer & Evans, Crooks by special appointment to the Tri-lateral Commission

  1. Wonder how much they are spending trawling through the social media histories of members, so-called “Trot hunting” or seeking to find those who may have expressed a little too much sympathy for the Palestinians dire plight?

    Staffer : There are still trots hidden in these lists boss, I can smell ’em!

    Manager : Then keep trawling!

    1. Isn’t this just another day at the office of how UKPLC rewards the fat cats off ordinary working class people.This maybe a labour party but they are as capitalist and eletist as any other rip off business in the UK.How can you throw money at these parasites when unlike strategic Utilities you have a choice.Dont feed the parasites and look to a new party that will take on the establishment that are bleeding you dry to throw your lives away on the demands of a unelected world order.

  2. How can any company (that’s what the party is) justify reducing staff to save money. Only for those savings to be swallowed up by an increase in management salaries. Now unless and it’s possible I’ve missed Starmer criticising the pay of bosses. For me this revelation goes some way as to why Starmer is reluctant to do so. Especially when you have Mandelson in charge who appears to be very fond of the wealthy.

  3. Expel members, sack staff, and pay themselves whopping salaries.

    AKA. Asset stripping.

    1. Asset stripping toffee?You may have hit the nail on the head,I feel a little stupid I wonder if the properties owned by the members have been “mortaged” for more of the readys?…Its looking like the jobs done ✔and the starmeroid gang have bled the labour party dry and its members .I bet Steve H feels a bit of a “chump” having worked night and day for “pennys” whilst the gang were lining their pockets.

      1. The wee fella isn’t even worth pennies Joseph.

        Surely keef & co can’t be paying him….And if they are then it most certainly can’t be performance related pay.

  4. Starmers last throw of tbe dice. He must win election and be PM and bring in public funded parties or resign leaving a bankrupt party. He then gets a very highly paid role in the EU, UN or similar and cuts the wreckage adrift blaming the members.

    1. Nail on the head plain citizen…..bags packed and flights booked for the promised land.Greasy lawyer makes good and the gang flee after the successful wrecking job ably assisted by members money 💰

  5. Let’s again hear how they’re skint because keef & fat Dave had to budget for Corbyn & formby’s administration….😙🎶

    Yet more bollocks.

    1. She’s probably referring, among other things, to the payouts they were legally advised not to make but did so anyway.

      The weaponising of antisemitism don’t come cheap, and who was responsible for that?

  6. Perfect title for the book Starmer received a £18,450 advance payment from HarperCollins for :

    How I destroyed the Labour party in under 3 years

  7. Almost two hours in, and no type of evasion, irrelevant question or smartarsed comment.

    How to explain this one away? The briefing must be quite thorough. 😙🎶

  8. Unions and Members will be expected to bail the fuckers out
    Every day they fail to challenge PWC, the debt increases by £27,000, every week £200,000, every month £800,000, every year £10,000,000
    They were bailed out this year by a Pension surplus, that’s a one off, the underlying mismanagement of finances is criminal
    True Tories
    Exploitation and Extraction

    1. And this while the media are busily blowing smoke up their arses, as if they’re Labour’s saviours.

      Crazy country.

      1. Poundshop War Criminal

        A pale imitation of his mentor
        Soon to be former leader of the Labour party
        In the future he will be known as the accused or the defendant

    2. Given that you never stop complaining about the unions and the SCG and Jeremy Corbyn and the left and how useless and inadequate they are, why do you – and why would you – spend so much time posting on a left-wing blog every day in practically every thread if that’s what you think of them. Could you explain.

      1. I was addressing ‘doug’ of course.

        PS And thinking about it, perhaps SH could explain why he does so as well – ie post practically every single day in practically every single thread. Yes, we all know that he does so just to irritate posters and wind them up, and so as to try and discredit JC and the left on the one hand and defend Starmer and Co on the other of course, but what is HIS reason for doing so.

        Could you explain Mr H?

      1. Qwertboi
        Cancelled Direct Debit a good while ago, assuming I’m out of the party

        Alan Howard
        When I was a caseworker you can only give best advice with all of the choices and responsibilities associated
        If my clients fail to take advice I also told them what will be the consequences
        Nudge theory is a lot gentler, you try and chivvy people in the right direction
        The consequences of not standing upto your enemies are long established throughout history
        Which part of JC is not a leader do you challenge
        No matter what Red Tories do to our party, the Unions are equally spineless
        At least members are voting with their feet but still not enough to tip party into insolvency
        What’s your cunning plan to rid us of these toerags

      2. And who exactly are you hoplng to ‘nudge’ by calling them useless and splneless etc?

        As for standing up to your enemies, the problem as you WELL know of course is that the corporate media and the semi-corporate BBC are the enemy of the left, and THEY control the narrative and give a voice and legitimacy to all the OTHER enemies of the left. And they have made that more than evident during the past seven years.

        Anyway, so how long are you gonna give it before you give up with your nudging tactic?! You’ve already been doing it for several years, haven’t you? And how would you know if any of the people you’re trying to nudge ever visit this site?? Hmm……

      3. Alan Howard
        I remember JC on the anniversary of Cable Street proudly telling everyone there about his mum being one of those who stood against the Fascists
        On the day it was the police who were Crackin heads and it was the women that defeated them
        Do you know how they did it
        JC did not stand and fight when he was charged by MSM and toilet papers
        Now give us your cunning plan to get rid of Red Tories

  9. Did anybody really expect anything different from this bunch of careerists? Their remit for which they are clearly very well paid is to neuter the Labour party – make it a socialist free Zionist party -so that in the unlikely event of it ever winning an election the capitalists and Zionists will have nothing to worry about.

  10. I read just recently that the LP under Starmer is spending around £2 million a year on legal costs, compared to an average of £200,000 a year before.

    1. It’s all those non-disclosure agreements that the billionaires insist on when they ‘invest’ donations to Labour so they can’t be sued when Starmer gifts them the NHS, railtrack, the National Grid, etc., etc?

      1. On this general subject area has anyone clocked the recent changes introduced by the Charities Commission which allows trustees of Charities to be paid for providing services and goods to the Charities of which they are a Trustee?

        The potential for what is known as ‘graft’ in this legalising of such a conflict of interest will be off the scale and the subject of future scrutiny long after the damage has been done.

        As such it represents another example of the rent extracting principle of our Feudal Lords in action.

  11. Usually tinpot dictators and their lackeys wait until they’ve successfully rigged the election**, and even then they pilfer the state’s assets and award themselves huge increases – paid for by the state they’re fleecing, rather than from their own party’s membership/funding.

    Smarmerite labour can’t even get mugabe Zanu PF or putin united Russia right.

  12. They don’t need members- we can tell that from the way in which they expel them by the tens of thousand- and they don’t need campaigners.
    Now that they are established as the ‘Democrats’ to the Tory ‘Republicans’ they can expect their share of power delivered to them by courtesy of the state and the media. All that they have to do is sit back and enjoy themselves- their only enemies are the people who realise what is going on. And there aren’t very many of them, in part because it was Labour’s job to produce them by political education, agitation, campaigning and propaganda.
    The first priority of every socialist should be to kick the cuckoos out of the poor man’s nest. They have been there so long it might take a fire-and a new start- to get rid of them.
    But get rid of them we must.

    1. That ex-Israeli Defence Force cyber-warfare intelligence officer’s services probably don’t come cheap.

      He’s reportedly involved in social media and messaging? Makes you wonder what exactly he offers and what his role really is? Hence the membership historic social media posting trawling questions?

      We’ve had big scandals with Israeli spyware firm NSO group, their highly sophisticated exploits found their way on to leading European politicians mobile devices – currently subject to a big EU investigation.

      He worked in Unit 8200 and then the Office of Keir Starmer. How did Starmer get approval from UK intelligence agencies for this sensitive hire? And why couldn’t he hire a Brit? Everything about it seems sketchy as fcuk. Like everything to do with Starmer seems to be.

  13. £5m loss, Labour boosts cash for ‘senior management’ by 65%

    What’s the difference between this and the fact that the cost-of-living crisis is in-part caused – and certainly worsened – by large, powerful corporations increasing their profits by up to 34% on pre-pandemic levels? As Tribune’s editorial pointed out “grotesque corporate profiteering is driving a cost-of-living crisis” and the Labour party under Starmer is not part of the solution, but part of the problem.

    BTW: The very same Tribune Editorial included Ronan Burtenshaw’s words “There is only one force on earth thast Organised Wealth fears, and that is Organised Labour.” Starmer, Evans & others in the PLC (Well, Rachel Reeves for sure) have made it their mission to dis-organise Labour.

  14. Starmer : How can this be? look at this graph, we’ve gained all these members, nearly a hundred thousand.

    Staffer : Er, you’re holding it upside down Sir, those are the members who’ve quit.

  15. The Labour Party consists of two type of people – those who are on the make & mugs. Guess which category makes up the majority – anyone for a fund raiser?

  16. “There is only one force on earth that Organised Wealth fears, and that is Organised Labour.”

    Well if Starmer and Co thought they could kill
    off Organised Labour by attacking the left in
    the Labour Party they are sadly mistaken –
    – they will find it has popped up in the guise
    of The Unions.

    1. Exactly Holby, but the unions need at least parts of the Labour party to be ‘in their corner’. Under Starmer, none of it is – and the p-arts that would like to be are marginalised or suspended.

      The theory goes: trade unions need a parliamentary political wing, the Labour party. If party and unions are not integrated (affiliated) and using the same hymsheet, then trade unions have no parliamentary presence, no political influence and can be treated as the “enemy within”. There is no Labour Movement in the country at large. Starmer – and Blair before him but no other leader of the plp intentionally try to fracture the relationship between Unions and Labour party, i.e. to make the Labour Movement ineffective.

      That was an egg-sucking lesson, I know (sorry), but maybe some people need to be reminded of the organic bond that should exist between party and unions in the Labour Movement.

  17. radical restraint starmer will quietly look at his feet while the tories launch an attack on workers rights. people seem quiet in these serial years of chaos and hardship – unions looking like the last gasp, hope not.

  18. Organised labour will win through despite the labour party being in the way of the working class people.You can only kick a dog 🐕 so often that it either bites back or dies.My moneys on the working class finaly realising the power of the majority and bites back.Theres upset 😡in leafy Surrey were the tory faithful are turning,revolution in the shires?Sussex and kent are drowning in shit and the utilities rule…sewage treatment abandoned…water leaking away…no storage capacity…reservoirs from the Victorian era run dry…..and mister and mrs commuter cant find a train running in the “green and pleasant land” ….ITs going to be a make or break winter and we are still looking for a leader in a new party?

      1. I know that my redeemer liveth – He still scareth the begorrah out of Sir Keir ‘show–me-your-papers’ Starmer and that Organised Wealth isn’t so fond of him either. Funny that. You?

      2. only in the workings of your shill-like mind Steveh-lad, the rest of us are using english as it was intended.

      3. Steve H No but I never see him as a leader just the most honest and respected recruitment sergeant for a new left wing party.Whether he wants to extend justice and peace or retire I do not know.What I do know is that people like me ex labour will soon like me be fixed up with another socialist party and the bulk of the labour party will have missed a chance for real change…..time is running out for not just the labour party which can never be a force for good.but for a new working class party to represent ordinary joe.and the bulk of Britain who have to struggle to make a living and survive.Stevie boy its people like you who have brought this country to its knees.

      4. qwertboi – You may well be a member of a small but dedicated band of believers but your problem is that the majority of the electorate don’t agree with you. We went into the 19GE with two thirds of the electorate consistently expressing that they disliked Jeremy Corbyn

      5. qwertboi – I don’t doubt you, but as we saw at the 19GE the enthusiastic applause of a few hundred dedicated fans doesn’t necessarily translate into enough votes to win. As I pointed out above, going into the 19GE a substantial majority of the electorate just didn’t like and/or trust him.

  19. Someone’s still donating to Labour Party though –
    they got more than the Tories apparently! I read
    it in the MSM – can’t remember where .. To my
    recollection it didn’t say who the donors were.

    I take your point about the Unions requiring
    parliamentary back up .. However I think there
    are more potential MP backers than you think.

    A lot are keeping quiet – as they have done
    in all states at all times when faced with
    a Dictator. Some will have principled
    objections about the way Starmer is
    behaving and for some “pragmatism

    More importantly the PEOPLE are backing the
    Unions. Although they are understandably
    upset about Strike(s) they are always quick
    to add that “they have a point”.

  20. I wonder if the “total employment benefits” for the senior management group include substantial additions to their personal pension pots.
    It is not unknown for dodgy businesses to engineer their own bankruptcy in a manner which is usually very advantageous for the top brass with snouts in the trough.
    This can include extraordinary top-ups to the pension pots of the fattest pigs, new top-of-the-range company cars, etc., ……. all of which they take with them as the ship goes down.
    Just saying !! ?? !!

  21. but as we saw at the 19GE the enthusiastic applause of a few hundred dedicated fans doesn’t necessarily translate into enough votes to win

    Nor was 70% of the membership (apparently – it was never put to a vote) ever gonna be enough to win the 19 election …

    1. Ged – You’re right the 28,000,000+ voters who disliked Corbyn outnumbered the Labour Party’s membership by a considerable margin.

  22. It is a well known fact that the way to make poor people work harder is to give them less money, and the way to make well off people work harder is to give them lots more money.

  23. Reading these facts one wonders how anyone with any (alleged) cognitive abilities (are you there steveH?) and/or (again alleged) real world experience (again are you there steveH) seriously believes that such people, receiving such high salary increases, can ever hope to represent the interests of the majority of people and that of the Country?

    They have no experience of the real world from which they are cosseted. They live in a bubble fantasy world in which they cannot hope to ever comprehend what is required to change things for the better.

    – A couple of days ago I listened to a short video discussion in which one of the participants related their recent experience of a few days earlier travelling back to the UK from a short visit to Greece.

    The plane was delayed arriving in Greece from the UK. During the, again delayed, journey back to Heathrow the pilot relayed in detail to the passengers the why’s and wherefores and what they could expect on arrival back in the UK when the plane landed at Heathrow.

    The key problem is lack of staff. Even experienced staff, like maintenance crews (aircraft, for reasons which don’t need elaborating, require regular maintenance and safety checks). Apparently, it is not only baggage handlers, cleaners, counter staff, and similar but also maintenance staff who are so badly paid that many are simply just not turning up for work.

    Which means longer delays for necessary safety and maintenance for aircraft as well as people spending an inordinate number of hours awaiting to reclaim their luggage before they can continue their journey home.

    – An individual of my acquaintance has over the past year or so been active in supporting striking courier workers (Just Eat, Uber, etc). The situation for these workers at the bottom of the food chain provides a microcosm of the basic problem which is set to spread and grow exponentially in the coming months.

    In essence those who do this work are ‘self employed’. Effectively a euphemism term in the present context which is misleading. The term “self employed” traditionally regarded as fairly well off (tradesmen who charge £55 just for being called out before you consider parts and labour; local vehicle maintenance garages; milk rounds and so on).

    Its misleading because most of those doing this kind of work are on not much more than half what my state Pension is. On top of that they don’t get paid for waiting around at food outlets which are are slow to give them their order. A few weeks ago I sat in a busy cafe and watched two of these workers frustratingly stood outside for half an hour waiting for the order they had to deliver. Time they were not earning anything.

    Additionally, they have to pay for the fuel (along with other associated costs like insurance, road tax, service and maintenance) required to power whatever mode of transport used to enable them to deliver the orders which they are paid a pittance to deliver.

    With the cost of fuel increasing, for too many in this line of work the choice is becoming quite stark. They are in essence going into debt just to work. If they don’t go to work they don’t get any money to live on. However, if they do go to work, with the present unsustainable costs involved, they end up paying out more than they are earning.

    i.e they lose more money through going into debt. Its a no brainer in terms of the equation.

    And they are not an outlier by any means. Stood on a picket line with former work colleagues the other week I spoke with a contractor doing the kind of work I used to do who needs five jobs a day to earn a living. That day, and the previous Friday, he had only been allocated two jobs. On this particular day he could not even do those jobs because the consumables he needed were not available as the stores were shut.

    The situation for millions of people in the country is that they are paying to work. They are losing money by going to work. This is as a direct result of forty years of wage stagnation arising from an economy which has been totally wrecked by being deliberately moved from a productive economy producing profits via adding real value to a financialised rent extracting economy. run by parasites who have politicians like Starmer and the careerist managerial functionaries they hire at every level in their back pockets.

    This is not even close to Capitalism in terms of the criteria set out by such as Smith, Ricardo, Locke, Marx etc. It is pre-capitalist. Feudal in fact.

    In this case our Feudal Lords – who never went away – have simply gone past the slave stage – at least slaves got fed and sheltered – by heading straight for making the serfs (that’s us) pay to go to work.

    – The other day I posted on another thread a link to an article by a Scottish blogger, Robin Mcalpine. Whilst that piece was mainly about how Starmer and those who cheerlead for him represented everything that is wrong with Britain the key underlying contextual theme was how systems across the board have been deliberately allowed to deteriorate to such an extent that there no longer exists the capacity anywhere or at any level within the country to recover those vital and necessary systems. One of the key issues being the deliberate elimination of any experience and expertise from the the entire workforce everywhere in every organisation and institution over the past several decades because the only accepted and recognised skill is “Management.”

    Every other task can be done by people recruited from the bus stop after a fifteen minute CBT package and half a day out with someone whose being doing the work for a whole fortnight already.

    Mcalpine’s most recent post:

    goes into more detail using the example of the present ever worsening crisis at community level. After setting some context….

    “the poor effectively pay five times as much as the rich in Council Tax, wealthy landowners are untaxed, we have Europe’s worst local democracy, communities are poorly supported, our care provision is fragmented and substandard, corporations were given privileged status and it was the bulk housing developers and the landlords who were backed, not homeowners and not tenants.”

    ….he describes a familiar grassroots problem – what I call, having experienced it numerous times over several decades, the ‘Parish Guardians’ problem:

    “So if we can’t expect anything from above, what about from below? This is where my hopes would usually lie. To give you an example, the idea that corporate local authorities should be bringing in KPMG to develop a costly plan for turning sports centres into ‘warm banks’ where desperate people can huddle until they stop shivering is not a good one.

    In the last couple of weeks I’ve been lucky to see round two great community-driven initiatives (I won’t name them because everyone in Scotland is afraid of recriminations if they make any public criticism of officials). Both are the kinds of initiatives that could offer life-saving community help and support in a crisis like this.

    They save lives not because they prevent people freezing to death but because they give people the chance of relationships and community and activity that makes life worth living (as well as somewhere warm to go). Plus unlike the army of senior council managers they don’t extract very generous salaries.

    If I was tackling this crisis it is them to whom I’d throw the money, all the money I could find, straight to them without a single consultant or ‘director of community services’ getting in the way.

    But, like almost every community organisation I can think of, they have little official support. If it isn’t a councillor’s own vanity project, if the local authority managers don’t get to control it and if the PR department don’t get to brand it, they’re not interested.”

    A process in which control rather than democracy is devolved down to the lowest level. As experienced in every UK area in receipt of EU Objective One funding over twenty years ago. Its why in the ten years after South Yorkshire received a billion pounds of EU funding its GDP was below that of Greece (at least until the Greek financial crisis erupted following the GFC of 2007-09).

    Warming to the theme he continues:

    “whether it is the sorry nature of the political class, the often outrageously self-serving public management class or the disempowered and damaged communities that they have both left behind, everywhere there are great big barriers.

    And so onwards this sorry story spins, with spin being the operative word. The politicians strain every sinew to persuade you they’re the leaders this era needs. One more press release and we’ll be there…”

    The bottom line is, at least for anyone practical who knows their arse from a whole in the ground, that if people like Starmer et al are your answer you don’t have a clue what the question is never mind what the problem is.

    The kindest action towards those numpties who are so dumb and deluded as to think these people offer any kind of solution is to never ever allow them to be let loose unsupervised.

    The most practical and useful action would involve a shovel – to dig the hole and assist the hole in being occupied. Simply because such people are a clear and present danger to the continued existence of civilisation as well as the survival of what grown ups remain.

    1. Dave – You obviously haven’t got around to reading Labour’s new Green Paper on Employment Rights yet, a bill they’ve promised to pass in their first 100 days in government.

      1. Ffs…

        Green paper, schmeen paper. It’ll never get through as it is because A/ keef will NEVER be pm.

        And B/ In the extremely unlikely event he ever did, it’d be amended to be completely unrecognisable as to what it looks like today because keef will veer ever further to the right the longer he remains and the closer the election nears.

        Only took him a few months to renege on every single one of those ten pledges.

      2. Ged – You are the Tory Boy working to stop Labour getting into power. It is also worth noting that the TUC strongly support Labour’s Employment Rights legislation. Do you really prefer to be shit on by the Tories just so that you can persist with your pointless rants that offer absolutely SFA.

      3. I’d rather be shat on by someone who tells me straight that I’ll be shat on, than someone who claims to be my friend but then shots on me even more, and from a greater height.

        How about you tell us a difference between smarmerism and conservatism and try to convince me to vote keef…

      4. It says Daz on the side of buses but they don’t sell soap powder.

        Your problem steveH is that you refuse point blank to comprehend what the problem issue actually is here. The literal reality is that no one with any real world experience – based on copious example after example evidence and precedent – has any confidence that what you are holding up as holy scripture is worth the paper it is written on, never mind have any chance or intention of ever doing what it says on the tin.

        We have all heard it and experienced this before and no one, apart from numpties like yourself, are ever going to fall for it again.

        The Parish Guardians and their shills like yourself – which Robin Mcalpine is writing about in the link provided – have less than zero credibility. Simply because everything they and you stand for, everything, does not and has proven that it cannot ever work in the real world.

        Its simply a pale ‘me-too’ imitation of what is already not working and producing the kind of outcomes, among many others, which were detailed in the previous post.

        You have nothing, nothing, to offer. Snake oil salesmen such as yourself are an irrelevance. A species doomed to extinction. As Andrei Martyanov – – observes at the conclusion of this piece; ‘you made your bed, sleep in it.’

    2. Toffee: The reply you have received in this instance demonstrates the key problem that numpties like steveH refuse point blank to comprehend.

      What steveH’s reply tells us is that what matters, the raison det’re, is the organisation. Its all about the ‘gang’ ‘winning’. Just like with organised religion doing the business becomes, at best, secondary to the gaining of power over the other gang . Who are simply the other cheek of the same arse.

      The perpetuation of the the gang becomes the prime and often only objective.

      The question as to what the point of winning is becomes an assumption that when tested has failed time and again to do the business; to do what it says on the tin.

      To take a prime example of the problem:

      The unforgivable sin of people like Corbyn was not the alleged AS or any of the other bullshit. It was the fact that he was no amenable to the financial inducements of the Corporate lobbyists who use their power to control politicians of all party’s in order to cover all the bases.

      As a result, like night following day, bears shitting in the woods, the Pope being Catholic and so on, the self selecting Corporate Elites/Establishment wins whoever gets elected into “power”.

      As Macalpine accurately observes in in the supplied link above (will you listen as well as hear steveH, one wonders):

      “Britain’s politics are reduced to two people looking at themselves in the mirror while corporate media and big business lobbyists shout ‘don’t you dare!’ from just off camera. When the Guardian’s Starmer apologists use the word ‘credible’ what they mean is ‘acceptable to Britain’s elite’.”

      Right now the state of the country, the ship of state as it were, is more than adequately and accurately described in this piece:

      And numpties like steveH are arguing that all that is required is a change of whoever is wearing the ceremonial (because that is all they are) pips on their shoulders.

      Its tragic to see, it really is.

    1. For who?

      See previous posts.

      Have you any coherent, cogent and evidence based answers to what has been put boy?

      Today’s Odds:

      – Meaningless content free one liner: 5/4
      – Deflection: 11/8
      – Misframing: 6/4
      – Projection: 13/8
      – Off topic: 7/4
      – Spitting out the dummy: 9/4
      – Avoidance: 15/8
      – Bullshit: 13/5
      – Ignore: 7/5
      – Three Monkey’s Stance: 21/20

      5,000/1 bar.

      1. Dave – For the many. What are you offering?

        Is this rather feeble riposte the best that you could manage.

      2. For a riposte to be generated requires something of substance to answer.

        So far you have offered nothing. You have failed to provide a single, cogent, evidence based riposte to any of the points put to you.

        Which is, at best, consistent with your previous form. Form that has amply demonstrated you and what you represent have less than nothing to offer.

        When you come up with something solid – some evidence based responses and ripostes to the realities patiently put to you only then will you deserve to have any kind of voice in any discussion.

        Until the time, if ever, you are capable of bringing something of value and substance to the table all you are is meaningless background attention seeking noise. An empty vessel ranting to the mirror. A pretend adult with the mind and attitude of a mardy arsed five year old expecting to have its own way all the time.

        For those of us with genuine experience and expertise such sad cases as yourself always and inevitably end in only one way. One day, and this will happen, someone will shut your meaningless attention seeking drivel up permanently.

        On the basis of that stark reality Projection, at 13/8, has it.

      3. Dave – Oh dear. Yet more drivel accompanied by veiled threats. Is it any wonder that nobody outside your small sect is listening when that is all you have to offer?

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