“Offering insipid support for the government causes people to vote for somebody else or simply to stay at home”
Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn politely eviscerated Keir Starmer on Chaannel 4 News on Friday evening, as disastrous results of Thursday’s local elections continue to roll in.
Ever the class act, Corbyn refrained from outright attack – but the end result was just as mercilessly devastating:
When it came to the crunch, Corbyn said – without even needing to mention his name – that the ‘insipid’ Starmer’s craven lack of opposition and eagerness not to offend the Tories was the primary cause of the disaster at the ballot box.
And Channel 4 News appears to agree. Polling by the programme revealed that Keir Starmer himself was the biggest driver for Labour voters either defecting to other parties or simply staying at home and following hi abstentionist example.
Oh, how different the country would look – and how many more people would still be alive who now are not – under the Corbyn premiership that the Labour right immolated the party to prevent.
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So true, and it could be Jeremy’s ‘weak point’ he couldn’t be nasty if he tried. Too decent to stick the knife in but his point is well made. Starmer was too interested in wooing Tories than being loyal to Labour members and supporters. I wonder if anyone has ever asked Starmer if he’s a Socialist?
I’d have to listen to the episode again to be totally sure whether he was asked or classed himself as a socialist When Starmer appeared on Desert Island Discs he announced he was a socialist. I personally don’t think he is.
From the moment Starmerfuhrer took office he held meetings with right wing Jewish groups and wrote articles for The Jewish Chronicle. When did he do anything other than support the black ops team who destroyed Labours election campaign, reward them and make excuses for them? This rat from day one has been responsible for the dissolution of socialism within a socialist party and walked hand in hand with the Neoconservative & Fascist Party as the bodies began and continued to pile high. The rat is one of many Labour Friends of Israel Conservative Friends of Israel and Liberal Friends of Israel who all take the shekel to lobby on behalf of the Knesset in the HoC and HoL…Long Live Democracy, Democracy Is Dead! We’ve been screwed over for decades and didn’t know it. Welcome To Plague Island…an open prison policed by Israeli trained jackboots and Israeli made killer drones over our cities. Hoping to win enough on the lottery to get the hell out of Dodge.
What he says doesn’t matter. Every action shows he has no socialist principles. Therefore not a socialist.
He got what he deserved. He and his posse have disenfranchised members and voters alike, one could say there is no trust left over. The only decent thing he can do is resign and take his posse with him.
I think that most of the members don’t actually realise just how much damage they have caused the Labour party and the country by the totaly reckless way they ignored the plainly bloody obvious when they voted for this monstrosity from oxted Surrey and allowed the destructive power of the Labour right wing to destroy the hopes and aspirations of the working-class movement.Shame on you who voted for the class traitor and plant nailed to his deformed head Sir keir Rodney Starmer “The knight from Surrey”
Unfortunately Socialists are generally good people who believe what others say is an honestly held belief. Starmer has shown there is no belief he would refuse to hold to get him whatever he wants. Far, far worse than Johnson because he believes he is honest whilst lying through his teeth. We have a choice of two monsters and not very different.
Labour needs to make two major changes in the way it runs leadership contests:
1) They need to scrap the MP nominations requirement-most of the people the MPs have allowed on the leadership ballot have been utter disasters in electoral terms-Gordon, Ed, now Starmer. There is no longer any good reason to give the MPs a veto over who can and cannot be on the ballot for the Labour leadership;
2) They need to get rid of the requirement that the leader must be a sitting MP- the PLP have shown themselves to be a deeply inadequate group in terms of leadership skills, and it serves no purpose at all to limit the pool of leadership candidates to those who are currently MPs. All being a Labour MP means, in this day and age, is that you managed to talk 15,000 to 20,000 people into voting for you- in a safe Labour seat(the only kind Labour has now) that is no achievement at all, because anyone who was nominated as the Labour candidate would automatically win such a seat without displaying any personal distinction whatsoever.
Maybe a requirement that a candidate should be on the electoral register in the constituency for at least a year prior to nomination would help.
Possibly.
kenburch, my thoughts exactly.
I have been far too polite in the above article when I describe what I think of the members that voted for that “thing” that crawled from the Surrey sewer and voted for IT “You arse licking Coniving slithering bastards that casually voted to allow that creature into the Labour party must like him and the right wing rabble be eviscerated before a new socialist working class party can arise from the ashes to save the people from the destruction you unleashed by voting for that Swamp creature to hijack the country and leave us defenceless from the conservative and unionist party disease.
MOFOs!!!!
Jack T, he would probably fib about that one. I think we know that he is not a socialist. Do not expect him to be truthful.
.
Ken burch….youve summed up exactly why the hundred thousand and more have left the Labour party including myself who can never rejoin until the matters you have listed,mainly the power of the Labour mps to run a separate “party” within the Labour party and choose the leader of the Labour party and the type of low life character that they like to present us with..That type of destructive power is not democracy and never will be until that power to dictate the direction of the Labour party and country is removed from the PLP.Well done ken Burch more than any other comment you have hit the target spot on and at the door of the parliamentary Labour party allowed to rule without sanctions against the democratic socialist Labour party.
We already have TWO Parties within “Labour” The trouble is, that thing from Surrey spawned the one Party within the Host and they NEED it ALL, like USA.
That is the Nature of The Thatcher/Reagan Neoliberal Beast created for their Master The Elites/Machine/Establishment they created TWO Equally Evil, TWO Equally Neoliberal, TWO Equally Conservative/Tory, TWO Equally Neoconservative leaning, TWO Equally Corrupt, etc etc, etc Parties!
Thereby removing ALL CHOICE! Now Voters have no Choice! NO MATTER which Neoliberal Party you pick there will be ABSOLUTELY NO Positive Outcome for The People, for those in the top 5% it will be heaven, but for The PEOPLE it will remain hell!
If we were able to identify as 2 Opposing Parties within the same Labour MOVEMENT and be able to run ourselves as a separate Party, they know the 95% PLP vs 5% PLP will very soon be flipped around and the Thatcher/Reagan Project Failed in The UK!
That is exactly why they are still so Petrified of Jeremy Corbyn and The Democratic Socialists!
What we’ve proven, post GE2019, The “Corbyn Attack Dogs” can do Thatcher’s Neolabour Tory Party much more Damage from the Outside, than we could from within the now Culture of Fear “Party”.!
We can carry on as we did 2015 to 2020 550K guerilla/unguided, doing their own thing or we can knock on perhaps RESIST The Party’s Door and form a visible/quotable 550K Strong Democratic Socialist “Army” and “Attack” with a Unified Plan.
skellyknelly, I would also add another reform: MPs to be paid average earnings, accommodation to be provided at the Olympic village free of charge, and every mp to be issued with an oyster card. Admin support to be provided centrally, but mps to be encouraged to do their own admin, after all they are getting benefits in reduced costs for food. You might throw in London Weighting. also give them a railway card o they get back to their constituencies at weekends where they are supposed to be at weekends anyway. Seems fair to me.
That is a REAL problem in the UK MPs seem to get Celebrity Status as soon as they are elected, there are very few working in the and with the communities who elected them. If we look at Jeremy Campaigning, most people would be dead by halfway mark and he is bloody 70! For me a great inspiration is Laura P and Laura S, those two women have not stopped working for their communities at all, they just carried on working as if they were still MPs, if they lose Councillor status they will carry on. At the end of the day people do not vote for their MPs or The Leader of a Party, People vote for or against a Party, we had so much internal/external/international pandemonium 2015 to 2020, that really GE19 result was no wonder!
This time around The 90/95% Neolabour Party Tories are so Shit that many people consider The Inbred Buffoon Johnson a Safer option!
We REALLY need to Identify as having 2 Parties and separate the two, then let the Members decide which Party to Grow and Which Party to Shrink!
Given the disastrous result in Hartlepool (and elsewhere), I have a funny feeling that SteveH won’t be coming on this thread to say something to the effect – albeit a BiG Lie! – that the reason for the heavy loss in 2019 was because Jeremy didn’t inspire voters!
Interesting results and interesting comments. The electorate has told us Labour no longer a working class party but one of comfortable metropolitan uni educated public sector employees. What did you think of Peter Mendlesohns view of election results with Labour no longer in power? Loose loose loose loose Blair Blair Blair loose looseloose loose etc? (I may have lost track of the ‘looses’). He blames the effect of Corbynism, obsession with Palestine, remaining contempt for Brexit voters, and having such weak inept Corbynista fellow travellers. Special mention for half wits like Diane Abbott who lost 10000 votes every time she cocked up a simple interview and let’s not throw ‘racism’ around to try and stop criticism of her foot in mouth moments. All in all new ‘socialist’ party needed and the rest can apply to join the Lib Dems.
Stupid attempt at going after what you see as a soft target (Diane Abbott).
I find it impossible to differentiate between you and Mandleson. You claim he stated ‘an obsession with Palestine’? Personally I’ve not heard anyone mention it in regard to UK politics. ‘Contempt for Brexit voters’ are you fucking mad? It’s us on the left who were against the EU.
You really are quite a spiteful little shit.
Manddelson said the working class have nowhere to go expecting them to vote labour it goes to show how far out of touch this fucking cretin is and then starts to blame JC for the loses it was him /blair/cambell who started the destruction of the L/P and now weve got the likes of streeting/philips/nandy/benn/+ and tory lords such as bat eating mann /sex offender woodcock/and the nasty dirty vile austin how the fuck anyone votes for labour with these parasites in charge is beyond belief
Tony Blair claimed he was a Socialist.
If you look at most of Thatcher’s Neolabour Tories’ Wiki Pages they all claim to be Left leaning/Left and Socialist even Strotter himself! Anyone can write anything on their Wiki Pages or even more appropriately have any Troll Centre anywhere in the World Maintain their Wiki Pages for them to whatever Flavour of the Day is required!
Blair Hates Socialism, They all do, we can see that in their rhetoric 2015 to 2020. They are Neoliberals, Neoliberals are neither Liberal nor Centre/”Centrist”, Neoliberals are not Socialists of Left/Left Leaning, Neoliberals ARE Thatcherite Tories and Neoconservative Leaning!
I rest my case, surely in 2 Quotes:
“Don’t you Dare to get Cold Feet”
and
“We are not the party of people on benefits, Labour will be tougher than Tories on benefits”
Steve Richards…So did the Labour party,and was printed on my former members card..I now keep it has a reminder of what could have been,and also a historical artifact that shows socialism was almost becoming acepptable amongst the working-class till we dissed em..Hartlepool should not be written off as just another set back and a change in demographics or any other middle class nonsense.ITs the start of the death of the Labour party and all those who made money out of “being Labour” ..The last dance is over and its time to shut down the lights and lock the door.
I still keep my Clause 4 member’s card as a reminder of what once was & will never be again?
Class act and never a truer word said.
Interesting. Corbyn did something that he never did as leader. He kept on stating his point when the interviewer tried to interrupt him, and it worked. It’s a strategy utilised by the media (change the subject by throwing in another question) when someone is giving an answer they don’t like. Well done to JC.
As for Starmer, He’s utterly delusional thinking there’s even the remotest chance that he could ever become Prime Minister. More chance of Darlington winning the Champions League.
goldbach (or anyone else for that matter), can you direct us to some examples – on youtube or wherever – where Jeremy was being interviewed and DIDN’T persist in stating his point on being interrupted. I just checked out several interviews on youtube, and although the respective interviewers weren’t giving him a particularly hard time, not ONCE did he allow them to prevent him from finishing the point he wanted to make.
In the following video of an interview on This Morning (during the run-up to the 2017 GE) the two hosts of the program bring up anti-semitism at one point, and despite their interjections, he makes the point he wants to make. So given your claim, I assume you can direct us to some examples in which he WASN’T robust in making the points he wanted to make, and if they aren’t up on youtube – which many ARE – tell us some of the interviews you’re referring to. The part in question begins at 7 mins:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbt_cnAg1Go
NB And if Jeremy was ‘insistent’ on making his point in the example I’ve cited, then THAT makes YOU out to be telling porkies goldbach, because it seems HIGHLY unlikely that if Jeremy persisted in the interview I’ve linked to, then WHY would he NOT do so in other interviews if and when the need arises!
Correction: The interview I linked to above was just prior to the 2019 GE. It was the other two interviews I checked out on youtube that were in the run-up to the 2017 GE.
And goldbach, when you said that Jeremy did what he never did whilst he was leader when being interviewed – even though THAT appears to be untrue – were you referring to the short clip in the above article, or the full interview, because if you are referring to the short clip posted in the skwawkbox article, Krishnan Guru-Murthy only interjects ONCE. And in the full interview – which I just found, and have linked to below – Jeremy isn’t exactly being bullied by Guru-Murthy, so why do you paint a picture of Jeremy being continually interupted (and persisting in answering questions) when it wasn’t really like that at all. He just did exactly as he did in all of the three interviews that I checked out on youtube. So that’s FOUR out of FOUR interviews in which Jeremy finished making points he wanted to make on the occasions he was interrupted – ie in the three I checked out he was as ‘forceful’ as he needed to be when necessary. And yet you make the false claim that the Channel 4 News interview was the VERY first time he was ‘forceful’ when need be.
Why are you dissembling a falsehood goldbach?!!
https://www.channel4.com/news/its-up-to-him-what-he-decides-to-do-corbyn-on-whether-starmer-should-quit
…….. and in Tribune:
https://tribunemag.co.uk/2021/05/labours-election-defeats-are-keir-starmers-disaster
The other interesting interview on TV yesterday was with that icon of the unelectable left Laura Pidcock, she kept talking about a lack of proper socialist policies to cope with the enormous deprivation, homelessness, immigrants, drug addiction etc etc. She was Followed by a commentator saying most people aren’t homeless drug addicts or on benefits and why should people not in that unfortunate category (ie most people in the uk) vote labour? Point being if you want to get elected you need to get votes from people who pay (sometimes quite a lot of) tax. What can labour offer them? One thing they want is good education for their kids and in the pandemic the first thing it appeared the teaching unions did is be as uncooperative as possible. Interesting observations, where do we go from here? Diane Abbott with more slogans? Perhaps not.
Deprivation, poverty, housing are policies that effect us all. The broken housing policy in this country has seen people benefitting hugely from buying their council houses when no more have been built to replace them. This has led to massive inflation of house prices leaving some well off and many locked out forever. The pandemic has shown that two of the world’s richest countries, UK and USA, have been ravaged because of the appalling health of so many people suffering from obesity, diabetes and COPD to name a few.
Your comment is arrogant and stupid. If you can’t see where Pidcock is coming from and the benefits to society as whole of joined up social policy then you are a bigot of the worst order.
Some people are very “lucky” living The Cosy Life floating just above the breadline and their fluff bubble has not popped yet! Husband and Wife both still in Middle Management or Perhaps a small business, Credit Cards just about balancing.
So they don’t need to see us skanks in the REAL world. What we have seen since 13 December 2019 are a lot of Comfy Bubbles Popped by the supper speed of the rising Breadline and the many very long Rivers of Tears of those who used to be ever so cosy in their little materialist Fluff Bubbles, ignorant and blinkered to the REAL world that did not affect them!
It does not take much either, just one to lose their unnecessary Middle Manager Job, the other to be re-contracted to 0 Hours. One or both to have a breakdown, an accident and the other needs to care for them, etc, etc etc!
What those people don’t realise is that Life happens, and that is what we pay Tax for to have a Government that REALLY has your back to help you get back on your feet asap, before severe depression, etc, etc, etc sets in!
We have no Government who has our back, we have an Opposition Party who Puts INNOCENT Journalists in Prison, Promises to be tougher than the other Tories (who already killed 100s and 1000s through cuts and put 1000s more on the streets through Poverty!) on Benefits. Making them a Far Worse and More Dangerous option that EVEN the Chest Banging Inbred Buffoon BoJo! We have no hope of any kind of Support on the Future and we have no Hope of an NHS for much longer!
These Fluff Bubble types always reminds me of the Street Sweepers and McDonalds Worker who threw Mop Bucket Water and Jet Washed those Homeless People! They all lost their Jobs and would struggle to find work bc The Reason for Leaving Question! Ironically if they had no strong family network they would be getting jet washed/mop bucket showered out on the street by someone as ignorant as them right now!
For the Blinkered Fools https://www.youtube.com/c/InvisiblePeople/featured Sometimes we all just need a hand!
And in respect of immigration, we wouldn’t have an immigrant problem if we got rid of neoliberalism and US slaved foreign policy (helping America with regime change wars).
Your comment below indicates you support ‘Keir’, well he’s a trilateral, Henry Jackson neoliberal of the first order so immigrants are his lifeblood along with drug addicts and homeless……ignore them while you can.
PC not
Diane Abbott took more abuse than every other politician combined, so off you must fuck
Apart from that you complete Cockwomble you have inadvertently hit the nail on the head
We are the party for the ‘Many mot the few’
Which means writing off toxic Brexiteers
I voted Leave but would happily see anyone who sold themselves to the cheap and nasties for what, they are the first generation that wont be missed when they pass
Then they can face their ancestors
Good on the teaching unions for being “uncooperative” with the scheisters who are in government
(limited vaccination and kids back in schools in late 2020 and Jan 2021 = another huge wave of deaths). Instead of standing with the unions Starmer came out with his “no ifs, no buts” nonsense.
I consider Starmer and the Starmerstruppen a far worse Government Prospect than The Inbred Buffoon BoJo!
Assange will immediately be sent to his death in the USA, Palestine will be levelled by the RAF, Lebanon will be levelled for the Zionist’s Planned Xtian State, who knows what else in the ME! The People of Britain will be sent to Prison, for his beloved 10 year sentences, for merely farting in the vicinity of any “Landmarks”.
I hate a Tory, but I hate a Tory who connived and sabotaged BOTH of our Once in a Lifetime Opportunity to END 41 YEARS OF TORY HELL from right under our noses!
Just ONE problem for “Labour”, It has TWO Polar Opposite Parties!
ONE for The PEOPLE, as it should be!
ONE for Themselves and The Establishment aka Tories!
ONE Host Party = UK Labour Party
ONE Parasite Party within = Thatcher’s Neolabour Tory Party
ONE MUST GO!
Generally the Sensible approach would be to remove the Parasite within the Host, rather than to try to remove the Host Containing the Parasite! Unless of course you aim to destroy both.
If you have a Parasite infestation in your Home, you remove the Parasite, not your Home to rebuild it elsewhere!
The nature of Parasites are that you need to remove all or nothing, you can’t remove the parasite form 1/2 rooms, within hours those rooms will be recolonised and rapid growth resumes.
There is a Very Good Product available #VoteNeolabourPartyToriesOutGE24, It removes all Parasites, leaving you with just your Squeaky Clean Democratic Socialist Home FOR THE PEOPLE. By voting Thatcher’s Neolabour Tories out even if we end up with ONE Democratic Socialist UK LP MP in The Hoc + Democratic Socialist UK LP MPs voted IN at GE2024 + Our Exiled MPs and The Largest Membership, rejuvenated Membership, Squeaky Clean Unions, CLPs, we will have a Guaranteed Voice for The PEOPLE in HoP, without any internal interference and with Candidates/Councillors working their buts off to get as many bums on 650 seats as possible in GE2029, who knows what might happen!
PS. We could leave to form a new party, but TBH without at least Unite it stands little chance of success in my own opinion,
Well said Jeremy. But what a huge tragedy that this , true, but pretty timidly obvious, interview soundbite, is pretty much all that the still hugely popular ex Leader, Jeremy Corbyn, will do to either mobilize the remaining Left members to oppose Starmerism – Or, more usefully, provide the Leadership to build a new Left Party. Jeremy just wants back in the PLP, to once more be a minority PLP’ radical Leftie’, without influence or purpose – as Labour collapses into electoral oblivion on its now firm line of march to resurrected Tory lite Blairism. I notice Tribune mag claims over a 100,000 members have left Labour since Starmer’s takeover already ! This is probably correct – and the number of members will just keep on falling. Labour is finished. A new Left Party must be built. But the Socialist Campaign group of Left careerists won’t be a part of that vital project. They are mostly keeping their heads down and protecting their comfy lifestyles as ‘Lefty’ MPs. And a few empty Left Wing verbiage outbursts on social media from the likes of Lavery and Trickett, is NOT actually meaningful resistance folks, its just posturing to impress the gullible.
Now that Skwawkbox has become the uncritical PR megaphone for that ex millionaire Law firm boss, and old McKluskey circle crony, Beckett , and regular smearer of the selected Left Candidate , Turner, readers might be interested in this informative interview with Turner from today’s Morning Star https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/under-my-leadership-unite-could-look-confidently-future
Doesn’t look like any sort of Right Winger to me ! (Though like ALL the candidates he is of course undoubtedly an insider long-term union bureaucrat nowadays) . His real working class, ex militant busworker, origins stand up rather well to Becketts entirely non working class background as the boss of a legal firm ! I know Skwawkbox owes Beckett bigtime for bailing it out over that libel case – but really, putting up Beckett as the great Left hope, and constantly traducing Turner, the selected Left candidate ? Poor judgement by Skwawky’s Steve, , and it splits the Left vote as per usual .
Slick lawyers are very popular in the Labour party,They make great warmongers and can cheat and lie better than most.Now you would think people might Question the idea of another Lawyer with a sanatised background from the hot bed of extreme battleground Belfast would have a “History” ,try and find it and ask why he has none,especially when it comes to democracy and fighting for human rights in the statelet..Beckett is a mystery with a hidden agenda.?Steve Turner is the choice of the real left wing and a rock solid union man with a background easily checked out.Mud slinging by trying to make innuendos about Steve Turner is a disgrace and doesn’t stand up to scrutiny with the backing of the Communist party of Britain endorsing him and the morning star as well.Dont vote for another Lawyer please..I can’t take much more of them bottom feeders profession….The knight bliar..brown RBL its endless.
You have to ask your self why the Tuner/Starmer Love! If you look at the “Left” who support Turner, they are not/were not supportive of Corbyn for the most, The Anti Beckett brigade are “Fundamentalist “Communists””, who live with mummy and daddy in the posh suburbs and go to/went to Oxford/Cambridge.
The times have moved on We are Socialists, Democratic Socialists at that. It is interesting that People think Turner Owns no Property, and lives in a Council flat too small for his whole family, and has no “Careerist” Ambitions, yet he is going for GS of Unite!
“Becketts entirely non working class background” WTF!!!
Honestly you need to get away from the “Posh Kid Rebel Phase “Communists”” Beckett’s mother escaped one of Ireland’s notorious Magdalene laundries, ran to London, His father is from London and his mother from Waterford in the South of Ireland. Both of Howard’s parents were shop stewards. His mother, as a woman from the South of Ireland, worked as a District nurse in some of the areas of Northern Ireland most affected by sectarian violence. As with everyone growing up in Northern Ireland at this time sectarianism was a daily part of life and in many ways this formed Howard’s drive to fight for justice and a fairer society.
Howard was fortunate enough to gain A levels and to be the first generation of his family to get to University where he studied law. Howard worked his way through University and subsequently through his professional exams. Shortly after qualifying, Howard decided to set up a partnership based in Wallasey offering advice to working class communities, opening surgeries in the Leasowe Estate and at The Casa in Liverpool (home of the sacked Liverpool dockers) and taking responsibility for providing pro bono welfare benefits advice to the community of Wallasey when the Welfare Benefits Centre was closed due to a lack of funding.
HOW MUCH MORE WORKING CLASS DO YOUR NEED!
It’s not a Crime for Working Class to succeed in Life!
JFC! Jeremy did EXACTLY the same thing he got taken in by young “Communist” Posh Kids who know NOTHING about The Working Class! Mind you that is probably exactly wo you are!
READ their writings with a pinch of salt and a WIDE OPEN MIND because you are going to need to think in all sorts of directions, Go and look at their titles, don;t blinker scan, look and research, Just because someone slaps Communist/Socialist on their Website/Wiki Page/Blog etc does not make them so!
What I would love to know is why people like you are so dead set against the Working Class! Beckett is the new Corbyn, You should know better than to imagine that we will just take your shit quietly! You have attacked SB since the beginning, because they are one of the very few Non-Celebrity “Socialists” like Novara, Jones, LabourList, Momentum, etc, etc!
They say the Facts that need to be said! You on the other hand seem hot air and dribble!
Skwawkbox must be a Thorn in your Neoliberal Tory side! No cure for that dear!
Thanks for that Skelly “Tory neo liberal” .IN my life I have been called many things but never Tory neo liberal or anything close to the Labour right wing destroyers who own the Labour party.Now I admire your enthusiasm and your dislike for the right wing but you must learn that I making comments that are way off the mark about someone who is not known for being a right wing Tory invalidates your enthusiasm and comments,unless of course you are correct.in describing me as a Tory.I use my own name despite it being unsafe for me and my family.Traditionally I am a retired activist and I started off in the peoples democracy movement with Bernadette Devlin the leader on civil rights for the Catholic population in Ulster.I am not a great example of communication on the web and my background in education was poor…re the spelling mistakes and puntuation.Now I aceppt that you think I am giving Howard Beckett a hard time and thats your opinion,but he has a real advantage on here and thats okay by me.But the truth must “out” and its not going to come out on these pages because of a valiant effort by Squawkbox to support the Lawyer.Feel free to insult me,but understand that calling me a Tory is for a life long socialist a grave mistake and insult especially from my background which is well known and respected amongst the working-class in many countries.Try to calm down and understand that scatergunn approach destroys the debate when directed at a fellow socialist that has served inside of the Labour party.My team Bolton wanderers have just been promoted so I am in a celebration mood …your forgiven comrade.
That reply was for Jpenny, but I must confess that I somehow bundled you two into one aggravating message. As far as I am concerned if you Support The Neolabour Party you are Neoliberal, Neoliberalism is no where near Socialism, it is Reagan/Thatcherism. Neoliberalism is not Liberal nor Centre/Centrist. Democratic Socialism is Centre Left.
You know where you are either or, if you’re Democratic Socialist UK Labour Party Fine, I apologise sincerely, if you are Neoliberal Neolabour Tory Party, you are Tory like it or not.
NEVER APOLOGISE FOR THIS! “I am not a great example of communication on the web and my background in education was poor…re the spelling mistakes and punctuation.”
We are what we are, I am not a Grammar/Spelling Police, If I don’t understand I ask, but I will never correct you and neither should anyone else unless you ask them to!
“But the truth must “out” and its not going to come out on these pages because of a valiant effort by Squawkbox to support the Lawyer”
That is nonsense and you know it, one thing Skwawkbox is known for is truth and facts. Even O do not spontaneously buy Skwawkbox’s reporting I will have an internet dig of my own.
You say The Truth must out [this is from the mix up, but proves my point]: “His real working class, ex militant busworker, origins stand up rather well to Becketts entirely non working class background as the boss of a legal firm”
as per my reply:
“Becketts entirely non working class background”
Honestly you need to get away from the “Posh Kid Rebel Phase “Communists”” Beckett’s mother escaped one of Ireland’s notorious Magdalene laundries, ran to London, His father is from London and his mother from Waterford in the South of Ireland. Both of Howard’s parents were shop stewards. His mother, as a woman from the South of Ireland, worked as a District nurse in some of the areas of Northern Ireland most affected by sectarian violence. As with everyone growing up in Northern Ireland at this time sectarianism was a daily part of life and in many ways this formed Howard’s drive to fight for justice and a fairer society.
Howard was fortunate enough to gain A levels and to be the first generation of his family to get to University where he studied law. Howard worked his way through University and subsequently through his professional exams. Shortly after qualifying, Howard decided to set up a partnership based in Wallasey offering advice to working class communities, opening surgeries in the Leasowe Estate and at The Casa in Liverpool (home of the sacked Liverpool dockers) and taking responsibility for providing pro bono welfare benefits advice to the community of Wallasey when the Welfare Benefits Centre was closed due to a lack of funding.
I am sorry about the mix up, I am glad I could provide you with some facts about Beckett’s working class background, even if it wasn’t you who said it! 🙂 🙂 🙂
Now enjoy your Football Victory “You “Neoliberal Tory “Bastard!”” 😉
Dearie me , Skellyknelly, you are an over excitable chappie aren’t you ! Whether the ex law firm owner (sold for a million quid) Beckett is a sincere militant socialist or not is not decided by his claimed sad family background. That viciously Right Wing ex MP, and ex leader of the postal workers union, Allan Johnson had a family background of dire poverty that would bring tear to a glass eye — but he is, and always was, a total twat.
This , according to you, almost charitable law firm built up by Beckett did very well for him thank you very much . Sold for a huge wodge of cash. Beckett in adult life has lived very comfortably indeed – moving from his law firm to a golden pensioned top job at UNITE, The man has NO record or experience of personal trades union STRUGGLE at all. Turner is also nowadays a UNITE bureaucrat, but his early career background IS a solidly working class , militant busworker, one, and he is still very active in grassroots Left campaigning . see, https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/under-my-leadership-unite-could-look-confidently-future
Not quite the Right Winger, and choice of the Starmerites, that Skwawkbox has disgracefully smeared about for months !
You think Beckett is ‘the new Corbyn’ do you ? So Beckett is also a windy Left rhetoric spouter who, when it comes to the crunch simply wont fight back when attacked ? Because that IS tragically what Jeremy Corbyn , despite his years of socialist campaigning, turned in as a performance during his disastrous (for the Left) non-fight against the constant sabotage of the Right whilst Leader of Labour . Wake up Skellyknelly – you are obviously a sucker for empty rhetoric. We need leaders who will walk the walk , not just talk the talk. Where is there any evidence that Beckett has taken a personal risk in struggle his entire life ?
Your pathetic claim that either I, or indeed Joseph Okeefe. are any kinds of ‘neoliberal’, or ‘Tory’, just shows you need to read up on what the words means , laddie. and maybe read a few of our past posts. I am a lifelong radical internationalist socialist, with a record of struggle, and paying the price, who has written widely on the nature of, and need to combat, neoliberal capitalism, and Joseph is an avowed , proud even, open, Stalin-admiring ‘socialist’ of the old CP school ,so please don’t waste your energies throwing around terms you obviously don’t understand in a weak attempt at playground level crap-throwing. .
Its no wonder the MSM hate JC.A very intelligent guy up against pathetic stupid eejits(with a double “e”).It was the highlight of my day.And Lord Mandelson,a non-discript shadow minister and finally Stammer almost screaming-all saying that they havent won an election since Blair-think about it-why not?And the ignorant effrontery of Mandelson saying he was unelectable and living in La-La land.They all agree that there needs to be “change”-somehow I dont think so-unless they go further to the right.Pathetic.
Just seen Keir wants to move party out of london and get rid of brigades of woke media warriors and special interest groups. Fat chance. All the left carreerists love the wine bars and opera house circuit of the capital. Where is Big Lens flat (bought with union help) and Arthur Scargills penthouse?
There are many different perspectives on display on this site. It’s inevitable that everyone will say things that I take issue with at times and that there will be very much that I agree with, said by many, at other times. It’s good to hear a variety of views. Keep posting your views – it’s good to have a laugh sometimes.
Lose lose lose lose lose lose lose lose
5 million votes against the weakest Tory party in modern history
That’s Blairites for you
FACT
For the Tri-lateral Commission their member has done well-KS he has ensured that the status quo of the ‘establishment’ and ruling elite is maintained -any opposition destroyed by nefarious means.,including Kangaroo court protocols.
As for his role as Shadow Brexit secretary it was clear in’hindsight’ that this was a master stroke in the deviding and the demise of labour electorate.
He has focused on internal destruction of the Labour party-quashed any hope of the rise of Scandanavian Socialism policies.
As far as I am aware he has not made any comments on countries who are unwilling to be part of War Crimes investigation in the Hague.
If Labour had won GE19, the whole dynamics of the UN Permanent membership in the Security Council could have change.
Trilateral Commission must be proud of their boy- a JOB WELL DONE.
“Don’t vote, it only encourages them.” The voters of Hartlepool seem to have absorbed a bit of anarchist wisdom. Could we, the people, possibly do a worse job than the politicians? Why go to the trouble of electing a band of dissembling, mealy-mouthed, self-serving, cheating, chiselling, manipulators when we can take things into our own hands? Would JC be in favour? I think so. We make society function, we have no need an elite class of rulers.
Point of order
If anyone and I mean anyone from the left challenges TE then the right will put up an alternative candidate
Trust me
RaV
Don’t know why I’m having to waste time defending Corbyn on this blog. Anyone knows that a crisis is the time to strike, a time to introduce radical policies, not act like a Tory doorman.
Labour should be screaming at from the rooftops about Tory privatisation of the NHS and proposing radical plans to counter the appalling health of the nation not dressing themselves in flags.
Let’s compare Starmer’s performance in Hartlepool with Corbyn’s first by-election test in a Labour-held seat, which came at the end of 2015. Liberal columnists like the Guardian’s Jonathan Freedland predicted that Labour would suffer a disastrous setback:
Canvassers on the doorstep ahead of next week’s Oldham by-election report incredulity among past Labour voters at the antics of the men at the top … when MPs or other Labour voices condemn Corbyn and his team, their chief motive is not ideological disagreement. It is their hardening conviction that, with each daily misstep, the ruling circle is making Labour unelectable … Labour needs to rescue itself, not for its own sake — but for the sake of the country it once aspired to govern.
Freedland’s colleague John Harris recorded a video with the pithy title “Oldham by-election: Corbynmania collides with reality.” In the event, Labour not only held Oldham — it increased its vote by 7 percent. This was a small foretaste of the humiliation figures like Freedland and Harris would suffer in June 2017. Corbyn deprived them of the opportunity to say “I told you so” by adding 10 percent to Labour’s vote share, despite having had to fend off a leadership challenge during his first year in the job.
You can’t begin to understand the current shape of British politics without recognizing the importance of that moment. For most people who wanted to see a progressive government elected, it seemed like a very promising development. For the Labour right and its media allies, on the other hand, it was a catastrophe.
Under Keir Starmer’s Leadership, Labour Is on the Road to Nowhere. by Daniel Finn
https://www.jacobinmag.com/2021/05/keir-starmer-labour-party-election-uk-corbyn
Aye, don’t forget to mention that, eight months after the new Leader had worked like a beaver to get him elected, Jim McMahon joined The Chicken Coup. His misstep was becoming Watson’s PPS, when he got to Parliament.
You know what they say about ‘bad influences’? Stay away from them!
Oh, unlucky Liam shithouse Byrne🖕 😁🖕
Doh!
Gotta go to a second round… Prolongs byrne’s agony , anyway.
The SNP bubble
Is ready to burst, promise another referendum when 60% of electorate agree their should be one, not 60% in favour of independence
To win they would need to get 60%
Nationalism would go back into a self induced coma
Labour would finish the job with more powers for Scotland
Where, oh where, is our usually resident 24/7 Starmerite troll, Steve H ? No doubt desperately being briefed by Mandelson and co as to what puerile arguments to put up on Skwawkbox to explain away the sheer scale of the Starmerite’s utter humiliation in his English bailiwick, (in Wales , under a more Lefty leader, Labour is doing quite well . Those Welsh neo recidivist neo-Corbynites obviously didn’t get the headquarters memo to ditch all that commie social democratic stuff (“airy Fairy nonsense” in Peter Mandelspeak) , and focus on agreeing with the Tories whenever possible – and flying very big union Jack flags in front of campaign offices ! )
Anyways , since little Steve H is obviously having a difficult ‘wee moment’ , I’ll help out with the ‘usual excuses’, eg, “it’s all down to the long shadow of communist Corbyn still frightening away the mass of traditional Labour voters”. OR, “most Heartland Labour voters are simple souls – knuckle dragging petty nationalists to a man and woman – not interested in issues like saving the NHS , but just wanting more BRITISH nuclear submarines , and a union jack on every street corner – and a new royal yacht BIGGER than the puny £200m offering from the Tories – and NuLabour2 hasn’t yet managed to purge enough of its Leftie members to go ‘full Tory Mk 2’ in its policy offer ” . Or, ” The Labour membership are useless , undeserving of the brilliant leadership team . It’s all their fault – but better times lie ahead when those Lefty losers in the membership all leave – and Yvonne Cooper and Hillary Benn join the Shadow Cabinet , the ‘political Big Beasts’ with their election-winning genius ” .OR, ” Labour didn’t have any sort of electoral disaster at all – everything is perfectly fine, and who needs that awfully proley rough place , Hartlepool, anyway (not a decent wine bar in the place), and don’t forget Starmer is a tactical genius , playing the ‘long game’, so no need to panic at all “. Yep, I think wee Steve H will plump for the last one.
The Len McCluskey Election Special One
Political Thinking with Nick Robinson
The Unite General Secretary on Labour’s electoral woes, Starmer’s ‘failure’ and the politics of football
You can download it from here.https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p09gzdmb or listen to it on BBC R4 at 17:30 today (Sat).
Joseph
Congratulations 👏 to Bolton Wanderers
Will raise a glass tonight
‘Up me kilt’
Thanks Doug and its a late one for me to have stayed up to watch them get promoted.I would love to nip out to the bars here especially as the beers fifty cents a glass thats US dollers here,or local currency two thousand riel.Unfortunately its way past close down time in Kampot which is my nearest city for celebration drinks with the aussies,yanks French who make up the ex pat population here.I am booking into a four star hotel t
Thanks Doug…will have to celebrate later today in Kampot as its way past my bedtime for oldys and I am saving up for the fifty cents US for a few beers tomorrow,or even might stretch the finances with a good dark stout at sixty cents per glass….Its a jungle out there so they say comrade…cheers mate
Andy Burnham has won another term with a decisive victory
“Labour’s Andy Burnham has been re-elected as the mayor of Greater Manchester in a landslide victory.
The 51-year-old was backed by 67.3% of voters to continue as the region’s mayor for another term.
Mr Burnham’s popularity has seen him become the bookmakers’ favourite to become the next Labour leader, even though he is not in the Commons.
Labour candidate Paul Dennett was also re-elected in the Salford city mayoral election, with 59% of the votes.
Mr Burnham had to pause to wipe away tears as he thanked his family during an emotional victory speech.
He thanked those who voted for him and promised to continue to be a voice for “all people and communities” and to adopt a “place first” not party approach.
The Labour mayor said his three priorities were “better jobs, better homes and better transport”.
“Where the government gets it right and treats us fairly I will work with them but where they don’t I will challenge them as forcefully as I can,” he said.
“Greater Manchester expects nothing less.”
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-57037359
If you’re trying to paint their victories as some kind of reflection of Starmer’s glory, forget it.
lundiel – I am simply celebrating a significant Labour victory, trust you to try and find a downside.
I always said Andy Burnham has a good heart ❤ despite him being led astray by the PLP mafia ..I am pleased hes done okay despite Starmer being a Toxic brand in the Manchester area.Personal Vote and definitely not the Labour party brand since the knight regime rules at Southside.
Dudley West Midlands, the Tories got more than twice the number of votes than Labour. This is the toxic legacy of to Ian Austin and Tom Watson.
lundiel – Andy got more than 3 times the vote of his Tory challenger
Just heard on twitter. Raynor’s been sacked as party chair…. they’re turning on each other.
The forensic lawyer’s gone mad. Sacking Raynor as chair but can’t sack her as deputy….. he’s got his own Tim Watson to undermine him at every turn now.
My football team, Bristol Rovers, has just been relegated. ……….who cares about politics?
Steve Richards you have our sincere condolences..!
nd Boklton’s been promoted, Yay!