Public ownership is not nationalisation, according to ‘Labour’ ‘leader’
Keir Starmer has plumbed new depths of ridiculousness this morning on the BBC’s Marr show. When challenged for breaking his leadership election campaign promise to put public utilities such as energy companies back into public ownership, he claimed ‘I don’t see nationalisation there’:
How the hell else is something going to go from exorbitantly expensive private ownership into the more efficient public ownership that means money goes on services and not into private offshore accounts?
Activist account ToryFibs pointed out the obvious:
And the same thread points out that just twelve days ago, Starmer’s Shadow Energy Secretary Ed Miliband said Labour was ‘absolutely’ in favour of common ownership:
And Starmer is not just a grammatical idiot – renationalisation hugely expensive strategic industries has overwhelming public support, yet Starmer – in a ‘rocking-horse-cack-rare clear answer – said this morning that he has no intention of doing it. More than that, in his interminable ‘essay’ last week he promised more privatisation.
Starmer has betrayed Labour members and the people of this country who are groaning under the gouging prices of privatised firms in energy, transport and other vital sectors – and shown himself a multi-faceted moron this morning in his attempt to avoid accountability for it.
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As a member of the Trilateral commission, it is Starmers duty to ensure inequality remains. And preferably, as big a gap as possible.
He is no labour leader.
Just listened to it before.
And contorted myself into a grotesque shape like some sort of circus act, it was that cringe-inducing
No surprise here.
Starmer’s just doing his job – as instructed by his bosses.
… Looking after the interests of the rich and powerful who have colonised the Labour Party.
Has anybody actually met anyone who voted for Starmer,other than Stevedavidh and Malcolm Colman?…Seems nobody wants to admit to being a half wit…?
Yes, my MP. Not only voted for him, but nominated him for leader (and the bint Rayner for deputy).
Do I regret working my butt off in 2017 to get him elected? Yes.
Yes, of COURSE Joseph, I voted for a fascist psychopath! Anyway, I just happened to put the following together a while ago, which yet AGAIN exposes Jokeefe for the lying little fascist shill that he is. It’s in two parts – because it contains two links – the second of which relates to Jokeefe:
The following article in the Express re LP membership numbers was published a couple of months ago at the end of July:
‘Labour losing 250 members A DAY under Sir Keir Starmer’s leadership – huge funding plunge’
There have been 120,000 paying members who have quit the party, significantly hitting the party’s finances.
There were 550,000 members last April when Sir Keir was elected, but the number has now plummeted to 430,000.
The updated figures were given to the party’s ruling national executive committee (NEC) when they met last week.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1468216/labour-party-news-membership-numbers-decrease-keir-starmer-leadership-latest
So given that was about nine weeks ago now – say 60 days – then at an average of 250 a day, that would mean that another 15,000 have left in the meantime, making it now 415,000 approx.
NB In a thread a week ago a relatively new poster claimed the following (in a reply to Jokeefe):
Joseph over 300k members have officially left and or cancelled their subs. And this comes from a person working in HQ. Don’t believe any figures given to you by Labour Trolls on here.’
And some fifty minutes later Jokeefe replied saying the following:
Baz thanks for the warnings but I have been told before and I guess it is accurate in fact its surprising if it isnt.I mentioned the over a hundred thousand because I didn’t want to get into a slanging match at the moment….
Oh right, so Jokeefe just happens to have heard the same, but he hadn’t mentioned it as such, and the only reason he mentioned the hundred thousand plus figure is because he didn’t want to get into a slanging match! Yeah, sure Joe! What a bunch of B/S from the bullshitter supremo!! Needless to say, both baz2001 AND Jokeefe WERE and ARE lying through their teeth!
Yes, what an amazing coincidence that they BOTH just happened to have heard this from someone – although Jokeefe doesn’t say WHO he heard it from! – who happens to be in the know! Needless to say, if you were told such a thing (by someone in the know), you would IMMEDIATELY be posting about it on here!
https://skwawkbox.org/2021/09/17/exclusive-labour-puts-left-mp-osborne-on-notice-of-investigation-then-rescinds-it-an-hour-later/#comment-198323
PS In his first post baz2001 refers to ‘a person working in HQ’, and then shortly afterwards – indirectly responding to something SteveH said – it’s now suddenly become ‘a friend I have known for most of my life’!!
Yep, the bullshitters on here just LURVE bullshitting the readership of skwawkbox!
As for voting for Starmer, as Jokeefe the lying shill would have readers believe: The following comment – which I posted several weeks after Starmer was elected leader – tells you all you need to know regards what I thought of Starmer AND what a lying little shit-head shill Jokeefe is:
The big give-away was that Starmer was being endorsed by the main-stream press – ie the same newspapers that spent the past four-and-a-half years demonising and smearing Jeremy Corbyn. As if the corporate media would have talked him up if he really intended to continue with the policies of Jeremy and the left.
https://skwawkbox.org/2020/05/07/starmer-breaks-campaign-promise-to-maintain-labours-left-policies/#comment-145020
And needless to say, I have NEVER posted a ‘supportive’ comment about Starmer EVER, and Jokeefe knows it of course!
Temper …temper mr Malcolm Colman(real name)not the Allan Howard moniker,but I new you couldn’t resist the bait and you exposed yourself and your comments seriously undermining anything you say….Ps the White flag man Allan Howard will never be forgotten…but will be forgiven by me.!
Oh, I just realised I forgot to thank you for the additional material! So cheers, it’s always welcome.
🙄
Bugger me Joseph, I’m truly ashamed I voted for the dame of blame angela illeagle – on more than one occasion ffs.
But then I console meself that it wasn’t the greasy- coiffured thundertwunt.
Our CLP nomination was Keir Starmer – but we soon changed our mind.
Bear in mind he promised to continue the Corbyn manifestos of 2017/2019 ..
.. as did they all ..
But the CLP soon changed their minds
Holbyfanmw please give the man his proper title Sir keir Rodney Starmer. A lorra lorra bent coppers owe a lot to the knight thats why he earned that title which means everything to him and nothing to a true socialist only a warning that was ignored.by the membership.There are also many innocent people who were banged up by the knight of the realm from Surrey..Do you wonder that Evans help us was from Croyden Surrey and remember not a lorra people no that except Lundiel whos marked his card…
Why can’t the stupid shadow cabinet understand their words at conference ring hollow when the deeply unprincipled leader of the party has abandoned the core pledges that took him to that position? Domestic and foreign policy, seemingly now up for grabs, available to the highest bidder.
Starmer looked shocked and visibly squirmed when Marr produced that pledge, as if thinking, ‘how dare you hold me to account, the MSM isn’t supposed to to do this!’
Starmer is as thick as two short planks, to say public services should be in public hands is not nationalisation beggars belief, unfortunately he has the brass neck to continue these inanities until he gets a hammering in local or other elections, hopefully before the next general election. Starmer to Marr… “Are you putting it around that I’m barmy” Marr.. “No, why, are you trying to keep it a secret”.
https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Alternative-Models-of-Ownership.pdf
Conference needs to show us clearly that the Labour party is worth reclaiming, that we are not wasting our time
We need to see Temporary Embarrassment put in his place, if the power still lies with unions and members then we can get on with getting rid of Red Tories
It then quite simply becomes a matter of time before they go forth and multiply
OK SteveH, I give Up. In what way is Starmer a Socialist?
Great gotcha! moment, I so wish the whole media would do this. If Marr can humiliate him this easy, imagine what the Tories can do come an election. Such slippery behaviour from Starmer. Who’d buy anything from such a dodgy salesman?
And the BBC’s normally the worst offender for inconsistency and shielding these Blairites; especially their main daily politics show’s presenter Jo Coburn, whose researchers suddenly seem to have no archives available to them, when a Blairite adopts a position completely at odds with that which they held a few years ago. A recent example being Chris Bryant and his contortions over OMOV vs electoral college.
And lets not forget that the party pre 2010 were the ones that opened the door to corrupt assessments of the poor, sick and disabled that has led to thousands of premature deaths.
Vicious circle
Blair/Brown – Bastard offspring of Thatcher
Cameron/Osborne – love children of Blair/Brown
Temporary Embarrassment/Baby Trump – Liars, Charlatans, Spivs and Thieves you only get with a lifetime of inter breeding
SteveH
Baby Trump and Temporary Embarrassment which one is a Charlatan, Liar, Spiv and Thief
Off topic, but Johanna Baxter has just told the Labour First meeting that the party’s legal fees are now £2 million per year and the main reason the party is laying off staff.
Good, and we haven’t finished yet. Baxter was one of the main protagonists of the corrupt campaign to stop Corbyn during the 2017 GE.
Well Nemtoma thats another novel way of laundering members money through his lawyer pals isnt it?Two million and rising no longer any doubt that the Labour party are in real trouble with the finances and even the BBC have turned on the knights shadowy Labour party.
There is an interesting new Survation Poll out
From each of the following pairs of statements, please select the one which is closest to your view.Base: Respondents who intend to vote, or would consider voting for, the Labour Party,
More left-wing style policies – 46%
More centrist style policies -54%
A greater commitment to public ownership – 74%
Less of a commitment to public ownership – 26%
A greater commitment to wealth redistribution – 78%
Less of a commitment to wealth redistribution – 22%
More distance from Conservative Party policies – 65%
Less distance from Conservative Party policies – 35%
Radically change the current economic mode – 51%
Modestly change the current economic model – 49%
I would vote for Labour if they offered big changes to society – 69%
I would vote for Labour only if they offered small changes to society – 31%
The economy is rigged against ordinary people – 69%
The economy is not rigged against ordinary people – 31%
https://labourlist.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/Survation-22-September-2021-LabourList-1.pdf
Interesting that the public do not associate “left wing” with the
listed policies starting with “public ownership” ..which they are
very enthusiastic about.
Well so much for those brilliant strategists .. Mandelson and Blair ..
It was pointed out again and again that the public liked the policies in
the 2017/2019 manifestos.. In fact my partner chatted to the Lib Dem
leafleter when I was out “door knocking” during October 2019 . She was a
nice chatty lady apparently (unlike either the parliamentary or local candidates)
and admitted that she liked every policy in the manifesto!
In my view they were badly presented – and in fact intended to cover two
terms but this was not made clear. Our MAIN problem was the second vote
on Brexit – the public were sick of it.
HolbyFanMw – Whilst I agree with you that these poll results appear to be in conflict Perhaps the participants like the policies but associate ‘the left’ with Corbyn and failure.
I disagree with you about Brexit being the main problem. Corbyn’s prevarication and betrayal were the main issues. We had month after bloody month of ‘constructive ambiguity’. By the time Jeremy got off fence and bowed to the inevitable nobody believed a word he said.
The real differences between the 17 & 19GE is that in the intervening period we lost 20% of the membership and JC had pissed all over his own USP and lost the faith and trust of the electorate. We went into the 19GE with two thirds of the electorate consistently expressing a dislike for Corbyn and less than 10% undecided.
The absolute fucking state of Ed moribund on ch4 news just now after being asked if he thinks stammer’s a good leader…
And I thought wee steven was firmly rammed up keefs ‘arris….😒
I celebrated the death of the grotesque maggie thatcher and swamp creater reagan by drinking a bottle of champagne on both occasions.
I will do exactly the same when tony the war criminal, the pedo buddy mandelson and the con artist starmer when they do too!
Forget to include that I have 2 bottles to celebrate when it’s a member of the family living on state supported estates, such as MR philip (saxe-coburg-goth) windsor and really looking forward to the day his misses dies!
You will hear more honesty by listening to 4′ 33″ than you will ever get from the con artist starmer!
I am surprised that nobody has commented regarding Starmers “nasty habbit” of picking his nose on camera and squeezing his runny nose.Can anyone explain this peculiar habitt effecting the knights “ruddy complexion.and wattery eyes?….maybe davidh Steve can explain this peculiar affliction.?
Joseph – Really? I can’t say I’d noticed.
You say its a habit but I’ve just finished watching Keir’s long interview with Andrew Marr and he didn’t touch his nose once throughout the interview.
Have you run out of straws to clutch at.
I dread to think of what you clutch at every time keef’s on TV. 😁
Toffee – Grow up. Your comment says far, far more about you than it does about me.
Of course it does. Mr Mogadon.
Surely Steve H Hall you must realise has a fellow sufferer that the knights drinking problem spotted at first in the lotto office and moved into the refreshments lounge for guests of the BBC has been noted.I don’t remember saying in the marr meltdown “but now youve mentioned it?
Joseph – What on earth are you blathering on about.
Foucault wrote about the power of language.
I always use democratic public ownership which is 21st C socialist language and implies the opposite of nationalisation which had the same bosses in control, was over bureaucratic, was top down plus staff and communities had no say.
You got what you were given.
Perhaps top down social democratic paternalists were happy with nationalisation.
Centrists are happy with common ownership, is vague, bland and can mean anything.
And Left Wing Democratic Socialists with democratic public ownership.
For example we could have buses run under the latter, owned and democratically run by local councils with elected bus users councils with a third of places to councillors, trade unionists/staff and a third to bus users.
And any community can make a presentation to these re their bus service needs.
Oh and have free public transport on the buses too.
(Helps the transport poor, environment & less stress on bus drivers plus car owners could save £500 to £1k a month on petrol costs if they could use the free buses, safer, quieter roads, fresher air, and if less cars more may be confident to cycle plus more efficient, with no faffing re change etc knocks 10-15 mins off each bus journey).
It’s free for older people at present (though it may be under threat from the Tories) and Corbyn’s Labour were to make it free for the under 25’s too, so we may as well go the whole hog!
Can’t be done?
The Tories were spending £187m every few months on the private bus companies to run virtually empty buses at the height of Covid done.
The Right in Labour lack vision and the political courage to be radical but the Left have it in abundance.
You suggestion makes sense and is 100% doable.
I am a bit lucky where I live [redacted] as it is wholly owned by the council, a labour council.
Oops £500 to £1k a year!
As detailed in this Corbyn era document there are many different forms of public ownership
https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Alternative-Models-of-Ownership.pdf
Off topic but maybe relevant.
It is my understanding that it is not legal to have water supplies disconnected from people’s homes.
I reckon people should go on a payment-strike in protest against the private water companies!
If the protesters are on benefits then the water company will just apply to the DWP for direct deductions.
Was that your department?
Toffee . No Steve H centrist Dad was a “Professional person” advising unemployed people at the Labour exchange before they had to “Let him go”..He is now scrambling around the windys looking for the mythical job hes been promised??
Starmer is as slimy as a greased snake. But he insults us by underestimating our intelligence. What else is nationalisation but taking industry into public hands? He is both desperate and pathetic.
What I, in common no doubt, with hundreds of thousands if not millions of others, find so offensive about him is that he got elected on false pretences. The person who was elected is not the actual Keir Starmer, but a mirage, an individual who pledged to honour and continue the political heritage of Jeremy Corbyn, who does not in fact exist.
Starmer, you are a liar and a cheat. You were elected on false pretences, all the time knowing that once in the seat of power you would renege on all you pledged to uphold. The only honourable thing (if indeed you have any honour, which I doubt) is to resign immediately.
The Trolls are grasping at the straws I see…..Polishing the Turd as hard as can be. Mr Howard now assuming the role of Deputy Turd Polisher. We shall see how the Party performs with Max at the helm.
Sadly for all those working class people who thought Labour might be the answer for them, forget it because #KeithHasKilledLabour.
baz2001 – The problem is that is that more of the working class actually chose to vote for Boris rather than Jeremy. It was the working class that put the Tories in office with an 80 seat majority and it was the middle class that saved Labour’s arse. More of the middle class voted for Labour in the 19GE than did members of the working class (they were all voting Tory instead of Labour, by a substantial 15% margin)
The problem is that is that more of the working class actually chose to vote for Boris rather than Jeremy
And the reason they did so was because middle class remainers refused to accept a democratically arrived at decision.
Although keef soon changed tack once you elected him.
And after being taken for the mug you are twice you still extol the conniving, lying rat bastard.
It does not need to be expensive.
These energy companies are basically billing companies and do not offer any value/benefit.
There would need to be planning to prepare for job losses retraining/upskilling fits in with Green New Deal
1 Set up a company with public money to be indirect competition-offering billing service- Centre based in the North
2 Nationalise the Nation Grid
3 This would be gradual process and should not be rushed to allow the ‘Market decide’ what customers prefer. Robin Hood /Leccy showed the way.