Poll: Starmer or Lavery to lead Labour back to victory in leave-voting towns?

The poll will be open until 10am on Christmas Eve. Answer order has been randomised. Captcha answer is required to prevent bot responses.

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  1. Starmer knows the most about Wrecksit so he’d be the better of the two in negotiations. And, regardless of being Remain or Leave, we’re gonna need a deal, the best we can get. Also, his forensic cross-examination skills will be essential.

    1. In fact Starmer is remarkable for such a once senior lawyer to have no cross examination skill at all. When he first appeared you expected him to eloquently flow in the way Silks are supposed to but instead it’s a juddering diffidence that is quite puzzling. The best thing you could say about him is that he is no rabble rouser!

    2. Jon I didn’t know that Starmer was actually negotiating anything , I thought it was the Tories as they seem to have just a slightly large-ish majority ?
      Why would they need in any way shape or form to listen to Starmer ?

  2. This is feeling pretty manipulative Skwarkbox. It is assuming Lavery is the only left wing candidate ??????

    1. There in NO ONE now in the Labour Party who comes anywhere near close to Jeremy Corbyn in their credentials to lead the Labour Party.

      1. Yeah, but he’s standing down Jack (as soon as a new leader is elected), as you know of course. So what’s your point?

  3. The real question is whether left wingers should fight for the existence of a left wing party in Britain or whether they should just humbly accept the BBC’s word that there’s no public demand for one.
    I recommend against trusting them.
    It’s shameful that Corbyn’s now being blamed even here for ‘losing the election’.
    ‘Labour heartlands’ turned kipper because of immigration.
    Half the PLP fought against a Labour win.
    They, the Tories, the WHOLE of the media and others who should have known better lied and lied and LIED.

    Some of you here have no loyalty, no shame and, more importantly, no fucking judgement.
    Jeremy Corbyn’s the most principled of all 650 MP’s.
    That makes him the only person worthy to lead the Labour Party.

  4. Here’s several excerpts from a piece (of propaganda rubbish) by Roy Hattersley in the Guardian a couple of days ago:

    A distinct and separate party of the far left has been a cuckoo in Labour’s nest ever since Ed Miliband’s invention of cut-price membership. Men and women who had spent long, dark nights outside Labour meetings hawking revolutionary newspapers came in from the cold – bringing their sectarian intolerance with them.

    Momentum infiltrated constituency parties, enrolled enough delegates to successive annual conferences to gain a stranglehold on party policy, took effective control of Labour’s national executive committee and attempted – with a measure of success – to “deselect” Labour MPs who did not share its prejudices.

    Thanks in part to Momentum, the Corbyn project was endorsed by thousands of good democratic socialists. The radical rhetoric obscured the fatal flaws of Corbyn’s philosophy – the blanket opposition to private enterprise, the support for any tinpot dictator who called himself a socialist, the intolerance of disagreement, the failure to cleanse Labour of antisemitism which proved that, although he hated racial prejudice, there were some racial prejudices that he did not hate enough. There is no doubt that there is still an army of Labour party members who cannot bring themselves to believe that the Corbyn project was destined to end in disaster. They have to be persuaded that Corbyn’s way could only ever lead to the disappointment of defeat and the betrayal of the millions of families who need a Labour government. No doubt Momentum’s leaders are still rejoicing about the control they achieved over the party machine. The celebrations are not being replicated in the food bank queues that, following Labour’s defeat, will only lengthen.

    It may be that the parliamentary party is not in a mood to heed the calls to arms. The self-styled “moderates” have always suffered from an excess of caution. But if there is to be a fight, have no doubt that the real democratic socialists will occupy the high ground.


    The most despicable bit is that it is precisely because of Hattersley and Co (and their corporate media buddies) that the food bank queues HAVE been getting longer and longer, and will no doubt continue to do so, but like the good little propagandist he is, he had to invent something (false) to ‘contrast’ it against – ie that ‘No doubt Momentum’s leaders are still rejoicing about the control they achieved over the party machine.’ Doublely false in fact!

    PS Oh, right, and it doesn’t have a Comments section!

    1. I don’t ever recall hearing about food banks until about eight or nine years ago. Anyway, I just did a search and came across the following:

      The Trussell Trust was established in 2000; in 2004 they only ran two food banks but as of August 2012 a massive 252 were being operated.


      1. And this from November:

        More people than ever are being forced to turn to food banks, after welfare problems over the last six months have led to the steepest increase in emergency food parcel handouts in five years, according to the anti-poverty campaign the Trussell Trust.

        The trust, which runs two-thirds of the UK’s food banks, said it distributed a record 823,145 food parcels between April and September, including 301,653 that went to children. This was a 23% increase on the same period last year, representing the steepest rise the charity has witnessed since its network of food banks was fully established.


        NB And thanks to the Guardian et al the problem will no doubt only get worse.

    2. Allan – I thought this might interest you

      ‘Assange Cannot be Extradited to the US’, Lawyer Holds at Court

      During a hearing before the Westminster Magistrates’ Court in London, Julian Assange’s lawyer, Edward Fitzgerald, requested Thursday that the founder of Wikileaks not be extradited to the United States arguing that the alleged crimes of his defendant have a political character.

  5. I’m still of the opinion that no matter who is selected as leader they will be slaughtered by the out of control MSM in this country , that goes for the leadership of ANY of the opposition political parties.
    Until the system is repaired as I have posted on an earlier thread re-setting Democracy from the FPTP and MSM monster it has been corrupted into by the Elite/Establishment , then all else is window dressing .
    The end result will be the same , a brutal pack of lies and destruction of party/leadership to ensure a Tory victory again and again.
    All the opposition parties have to come together to fight this corruption of Democracy , how the hell we do it I don’t know , there are so many venal MPs in all parties with egos the size of mountains , plus there are the ones who are “part of that very same corrupted system ” who want it to stay the same .
    But change it must and there is a greater good than loyalty to manifestos or party , and that is to the democracy that we live in.
    It must change and now is the time to start that change , we have new leaders in the Libdems and soon Labour
    Perhaps it starts at the grassroots with CLPs demanding via Conf that labour adopts PR ,Idon’t know but there are 500K members and there must be some way we can push the MPs towards negotiating to sort the system out , open to any suggestions or debate ??

    1. Blair proved that a right wing Labour Party is acceptable to MSM. It is Socialism that they seek to destroy.

  6. I have a tiny glimmer of hope that the EHRC will soon report that no claims of ‘Labour antisemitism’ are actionable, that a number have been proven to be deliberate fabrications, that for the majority of the remainder there is no supporting evidence whatsoever and that those for which there is some smattering of evidence have been so massively exaggerated that the only possible motive is political.

    If the EHRC wish to retain any shred of credibility they’ll also find that the Tories, as direct beneficiaries of the fraud, must bear a proportion of the guilt of the original fraudsters.

    By ‘tiny glimmer’ I meant vanishingly small, obviously.
    My expectation is a half-paragraph of “no further action” below the fold.

    1. Just for the record, the EHRC are not investigating individual claims/cases of anti-semitism in the LP, they are investigating the way the LP dealt with them, or not. Needless to say, it is completely fraudulent. I mean if the LP is infested with anti-semites, how come only ONE person has been found guilty of A/S, and I’m pretty sure they were a former member of the LP, before Jeremy became leader. Apart from that, four LP members were charged with A/S earlier this year, three at the end of March, and a fourth on May 1st, the day before the local elections, and widely covered by the MSM, who of course reminded their readers etc about the other three.

      Funny how the fourth person wasn’t charged until over a month after the other three AND that it should happen the day before the local elections, and yet ALL four cases were in a ‘dossier’ that the CAA passed on to the Met Commissioner very publicly – well they WOULD, wouldn’t they – the previous September! I mean as if it would take six/seven months to determine that what anyone had said or done was anti-semitic! In the real world it would take a matter of days! And Yes, the ‘dossier’, so-called, was undoubtedly comprised of cases that were copied and stolen by LP staff just before they left their jobs, and who deleted the original files.

      The very fact that the EHRC appear to have no interest whatsoever in investigating Islamophobia in the Tory Party – as the Muslim Council of Britain urged them to do at the end of May this year when it submitted a formal complaint – tells you EVERYTHING you need to know about the EHRC!

      1. Why is the EHRC so secretive? Why are all complaints anonymous & the substance unknown? Which definition of anti-Semitism do they choose to use & why?
        Very soon the IHRA definition will be accepted by most governments & institutions in Europe, which means it will be illegal & anti-Semitic to describe Israel as a racist or apartheid state. Many local authorities (including Police) in GB have already done so. It will be illegal to criticise Israeli apartheid policies.

    2. Do you really trust the system? Do you seriously believe the EHRC is independent & will be completely objective in its findings?

      1. Steve Richards 28/12 at 9:06

        I’m hopeful that they will produce an honest and constructive report that the Labour party will be able to embrace and we’ll be able to implement any recommendations to help improve our procedures. But honestly, like you, I just don’t know,

        However I don’t think indulging in ‘expectation management’ by questioning the report’s findings before it is published is a good look. Let’s wait and see and then we can react appropriately.

  7. is it a libdems style poll? where is RLB? I for one, will prefer her above a dozen of the above.

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