Excl: members complain of postal-vote interference by Hodge supporters in Barking selection contest

Ballots directed to home address of supportive CLP secretary – and addresses of postal voters apparently circulated only to MP and supporters, who have been delivering/collecting
Margaret Hodge campaigning for reselection with CLP secretary

Labour members in Barking have complained to the SKWAWKBOX – and to the party – about irregularities in the postal vote process in the selection contest to decide who will represent the party at the next parliamentary election.

As the SKWAWKBOX exclusively reported, Hodge was ‘triggered‘ in a vote of member branches last month, in a move driven by the party’s right – many of whom were unhappy that promises they say Barking MP Margaret Hodge made to step down at the next general election were not kept and who want an MP who lives within the constituency.

The SKWAWKBOX had already reported concerns over the fact that Barking CLP (constituency Labour party) secretary Saima Ashraf, who is receiving and collating the contest’s postal ballots at her personal address, had been photographed supporting Hodge during the latter’s reselection campaign.

But members now report seeing Hodge’s supporters carrying bundles of postal votes and also collecting – within an hour of the passing of this week’s deadline for postal vote applications – completed votes from the homes of Labour members.

Other complaints include that:

  • Hodge herself has offered to come and collect ballots in person from members
  • that councillors supporting her have done so, including bringing family members together to all complete their ballots at the same time under guidance
  • that the list of postal vote recipients provided to Hodge has been denied to other candidates
  • that some candidates’ statements, which should have been delivered with the ballot papers, were either missing or carried no details of the candidate making the statement
A ‘bundle’ said to contain 10-12 ballots photographed at the house of a prominent Barking Labour member

In addition, the ballot papers are not numbered or marked with any individual identifiers to prevent copying – indeed some appear to have been printed out at the homes of members – raising fears of ballot-stuffing.

The concerns were crystallised by a visit to the home of a prominent party member, when the resident said – before any ballots should have been distributed – that it was a pity that one of the candidate names was not higher on the ballot paper. When the alarmed campaigner asked how he knew how the names were listed, he discovered that a bundle of the papers was behind a sofa cushion.

The SKWAWKBOX’s unanswered query to Saima Ashraf

Complaints have been made to the CLP secretary and Labour’s London regional office, as well as to the party’s National Executive Committee.

Both Margaret Hodge and Saima Ashraf were contacted for comment. Neither had responded by the time of publication.

The selection campaign concludes on Monday with a final hustings and vote by Labour members present, to which the postal vote totals will be added.

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48 responses to “Excl: members complain of postal-vote interference by Hodge supporters in Barking selection contest

  1. Someone told me a funny story about locals – apparently some refer to the MP as Margaret Hodgkiss!
    Oh dear will Labour ever be free of Right Wing manipualative Bourgeios Barbarians?
    Will working people ever free themselves from the local dimwits and then the Neo-Liberall capitalist legal thieves?
    The Right Wing political morons keep the working class down.
    The Right Wing Labour lightweights would do a better job for society by spending their time on allotments (no offence to the decent working people on allotnents).
    The poorly read, politicaly Right Wing thick morons bore me to tears!

  2. After all the fuss I would have thought the party would have stepped in at least to collect the votes and count

      • No, Liz. In the Labour party, claims of AS only carry weight when they are directed at Corbyn supporters.

  3. This surely must be made void and all members invited to a proper hustings with a vote. The hustings in my CLP in 2012 also had a transferable vote at the meeting.

  4. It looks like the rules for these Trigger Ballots were very poorly drafted. Surely with just a little forethought all these problems could have been easily anticipated and avoided.

    Who drafted these inadequate rules and who signed them off. We the Labour Party’s membership have a right to expect better from our party’s paid staff and elected officials.

  5. Hardly any improvement in LP democracy or transparency in spite of a left wing leader and membership

    • Ray, because we have a right wing bureaucracy/management, there is little democracy in the Labour Party.

    • You’re dead right. Even the mass membership are totally disarmed. I even feel that it will be a good thing for the creatures of the pit to lose their seats. Not positive but they are vile and treacherous.

  6. In the above skwawkbox article (AND also at the time Hodge was triggered) it says that the reasons those that did so GAVE for doing so, was because many of them were unhappy that promises they say Barking MP Margaret Hodge made to step down at the next general election were not kept, and that they want an MP who lives within the constituency.

    Right, so how does THAT square with what Hodge said just after she was triggered, and as widely reported in the MSM. The following was the headline in the Daily Mail on September 29th:

    Jewish Labour MP Dame Margaret Hodge vows to keep her job despite claims Corbynistas want to replace her after she condemned the party over anti-Semitism

    Oh, so she tells her CLP that she’s gonna stand down at the next GE, and then suddenly changes her mind and vows to stay! Hmm…. It is of course something that she and her supporters concocted and contrived – ie trigger her for said reasons and then accuse the left of having been responsible, so as to generate bucket-loads of negative and condemnatory media coverage. I mean as if the Blairights would give a damn if such an asset to their smear campaign against JC and the left really HAD changed her mind, or give a flying fox about the fact that she doesn’t live in the constituency! And needless to say, if the left members of the CLP had been behind the move, they would undoubtedly have been saying that their reason for doing so is because of her unwarranted attacks on Jeremy AND bringing the party into disrepute by grossly inflating her claims of anti-semitic abuse made against her by party members – ie 200 that turned out to be 20 – AND also THEN claiming that if so few members accused of A/S are being suspended or expelled from the party, then JC and the Party aren’t dealing with the problem sufficiently etc, etc.

    Such machinations come easily to the corrupt and sociopathic!

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7518403/Jewish-Labour-MP-Dame-Margaret-Hodge-vows-job-claims-Corbynistas-want-replace-her.html

    • And I just want to say this in response to Jack T’s criticism of Jennie Formby on here a couple of days ago:

      I recently read somewhere, that when she was initially presented with the ‘new’ raft of allegations against Chris Williamson, that she disagreed that he should be suspended again, but it then went on to say that she eventually agreed. THAT is all it said, and in passing, but it has occurred to me since what most likely happened:

      Right, so because you know that Chris Williams’ court case is coming up shortly, and you know that you are going to lose the court case because you know that your re-suspension (after two days) was illegal, you present JF with the new raft of allegations that you have been scraping together since HE – Chris Williams – said he was going to challenge his re-suspension in a court of law (as he did shortly after the re-suspension was imposed), and you know that Jennie will more-than-likely disagree with you about suspending him again, so when she DOES, you say to her (in a veiled threat), “but what if someone leaks it to the media that you disagreed with suspending him, how will that look for YOU”, etc, etc, and you know then that she has no choice other than to agree to his suspension.

      Put it this way, Jenny didn’t disagree with suspending him and then just suddenly change her mind for no reason! And needless to say, we know there are still people working in the LP that are leaking stuff to the media. And am I right in thinking that we only learnt about Chris’ SECOND suspension (or third, depending on how you look at it!) on September 3rd as a consequence of it being mentioned in the Judge’s statement? And if that IS the case, then I can only imagine that Chris was told to keep quiet about it or ELSE – ie threatened with further sanctions for violating party rules etc. And if that IS the case, then I have little doubt that the conspirators did so because they only wanted all of us on the left who support Chris to learn of the new suspension on the day the judge ruled the re-suspension unlawful. They do so lurve to amuse themselves and all the other sociopaths/psychopaths out there, and there are hundreds of thousands of them, at the very least!

      Sorry, I didn’t finish making my point! So if the staff who presented Jennie with the new allegations HAD agreed with her that he shouldn’t be suspended (again), then – barring a leak – we wouldn’t have heard a dickybird about the new allegations (and they wouldn’t have been a factor in the court case), and unless they contested the judge’s ruling that the decision to re-suspend him was unlawful, Chris would have been reinstated.

      And I wonder if they missed a trick there – ie TWO birds, ONE stone!

      • And re what I said about Hodge in my post above (the following from a Sun article from July 23rd, which no doubt the rest of the Daily national papers quoted too, and NOT for the first time!):

        HATERS ‘LET OFF’ Labour expels just eight members for anti-Semitism this year despite 625 complaints

        Margaret Hodge, who lost family in the Holocaust, claimed Mr Corbyn, his office and Ms Formby “have corrupted the complaints process by their political interference”.

        And directly after:

        Ruth Smeeth, who is Jewish, stormed: “I’m not sure anyone could suggest we’re taking this seriously. It’s time for a truly independent process with no political interference.”

        https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/9560654/labour-expels-just-eight-members-for-anti-semitism-this-year-despite-625-complaints/

        It’s just one falsehood on top of another falsehood on top of another falsehood.

      • And PLEASE read THIS:

        Palestine activist removed from Labour shortlist after smear

        The activist behind an iconic speech on Palestine at Labour’s conference last year has had his parliamentary hopes dashed by the party, the UK’s main opposition.

        Colin Monehen announced on Sunday he had been shortlisted to be the Labour candidate for Epping Forest in northeast London.

        But the party emailed at 1pm on Wednesday telling him he had been removed from the shortlist “after due diligence.” They gave no specifics, Monehen told The Electronic Intifada.

        https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/unease-over-selection-of-prospective-parliamentary-candidates/

      • Allan, “depending on how you look at it”.

        There is only ONE way to look at it. There were THREE suspensions and Jennie Formby under pressure from the right wing and the JLM signed off on all three.

        It is completely unacceptable that members of the JLM should have ANY involvement in cases of A/S yet they virtually control the disciplinary process. This was a deliberate move by Tony Blair.

        Not withstanding that she was under personal stress, Jennie Formby has caved in to those who are trying to destroy both Corbyn and a pro-Palestinian Labour Party and in doing so has shown that she is unfit to be our General Secretary. Her failure to confront the JLM has led to the continued suspension of Chris Williamson, one of Corbyn’s strongest allies, which could and may mean that we will never see a Corbyn government. It is THAT serious.

    • “I won’t be standing again” always seemed like an obvious ploy to delay CLP action.
      Think I might even have commented here to that effect but can’t remember or be arsed looking back.
      I expect we all thought that, didn’t we? 🙂

      • “I won’t be standing again” always seemed like an obvious ploy to delay CLP action.

        Delay action by who? And what difference would Hodge have thought it was going to make IF, at some point, she was going to then tell them that she’s now changed her mind and IS standing AND they trigger her then. Such a tactic doesn’t make sense because it DOESN’T achieve anything, and DIDN’T achieve anything, if you believe it happened at all, that is.

        No, along with the “we want someone who lives in the constituency” line, it was something that she and her buddies in the CLP concocted as a reason as to why they were triggering her, cos they had to come up with something – ie some reason or another – to make it appear legitimate, otherwise someone might have got wise to them and twigged what they were up to.

        And I don’t recall you commenting to THAT effect, and why would ANYONE – let alone “ALL” of us – have thought that she did it as a delaying tactic, if a delaying tactic served absolutely no purpose, and was never going to if she was then going to tell them she’d changed her mind and was going to stand.

        It was, in effect, just another re-run of the Pittsburgh ‘anti-semitism’ motion, in which the right-wing Blairites do something knowing that the MSM et al will vilify and condemn the left-wing JC-supporting members for doing it (perhaps you recall the little tete-a-tete we had in the Comments section!).

        https://skwawkbox.org/2018/11/03/labour-right-blocks-pittsburgh-antisemitism-motion/

      • If the foul mouthed fish wife can get away with accusing Corbyn of being a effing AS ,and get away with it why should she come off the payroll of two employers that we know of .The embassy and taking the Labour party for a ride via the taxpayer..when shes only interested in Israel and a retirement on stolen Palestinian land

    • I don’t think that the issue is Jennie Formby, or the current illness affecting her.

      The problem is the attitudes – a combination of venality and fear – affecting the central administration of the Party. The zionist line has become so deeply embedded that due procedure has ridden to hell on a handcart, as predicted,ever since the cave-in to the lobby for the IHRA definition. Even where there is no direct venality, this has shaped a terrifying mindset reminiscent of the US in the McCarthy era.

      I mentioned a week or so ago how Sheffield City Council has blithely adopted the IHRA document without a smidgen of critical examination, and the University College incident (see the JVL website : https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/ucl-attack-on-academic-freedom/ ) is yet another example of the distortions of basic principles caused by the mindset of fear that the ‘antisemitism’ scam engenders.

      I think what I now find most hard to forgive is that the Labour Party has now become actively complicit in perpetuating the McCarthyite myths. This is the one issue that most makes me question my long-time support for the Party. It conflicts directly with as fundamental a principal – freedom of speech – as the anti-racism it pretends to.

      As to the latest Hodge issue – of course, I don’t know the truth; I live nowhere near Barking. But I know full well that much lesser accusations have led to the suspension of procedures or members.

      • I can only hope Richard that you find it in your heart to forgive them. The thing IS of course that with a totally corrupt media actively working against JC and the left, there can be no ‘freedom of speech’ for him and his supporters, because denial (of A/S)- as it has been repeatedly – is then condemned as part of the problem. As David says, in effect, in his post below, the media fills the heads of the electorate with Tory (think Establishment) propaganda on a daily basis, subverting democracy and attacking and vilifying and demonising anyone or anyTHING that poses a threat to the status quo – ie their power and control. I guess you probably remember the onslaught by the media against Ken Livingstone when he was leader of the GLC and how, when THAT didn’t work because he and his colleagues were doing so many positive and beneficial things for working class Londoners, Thatcher and Co abolished the GLC (and also the six Metropolitan County Councils which were also being run by left-wing administrations at the time). And THAT’s why they can’t let Jeremy and a left-of-centre administration get hold of the reigns of power, because the Establishment know that his/their policies will be a winner with the Many, and undo the damage that THEY have done.

        Without the media – an impartial and unbiased media – you have no ‘voice’ , and without a voice you have no freedom of speech. So don’t be hard on them, as Jeremy and his TRUE supporters like Ken and Jackie and Chris etc are in a no-win situation and, as such, it’s up to us at the grass-roots level to get the truth out there AND expose the lies and the falsehoods and the machinations AND expose each and everyone of those who dupe and deceive and manipulate millions of people and rule and divide us.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zm-YTu0qbLA

        (PS I’ve been listening to the album on headphones whilst composing and typing this post out…….)

    • Thanks for the info Allan Howard and the generous welcome to the newcoming poster and a new input

      • Or maybe just a one-off poster. They come and go all the time, like that doctor five or six weeks ago, when a bunch of one-offers came out of the ether, and then disappeared back into it just as suddeenly, never to be heard from again.

  7. Diana Johnson (MP for Hull North) was the first sitting Labour MP to be triggered. She has just been re-selected having attracted an overwhelming proportion of votes cast at the OMOV ballot that was held this evening (Friday), 292 votes out of almost 400 cast.

  8. Sounds like a nest of vipers in Barking. The Right Wing are not dimwits. they are well entrenched and well organised because they have been getting away with lack of scrutiny for years. Appeal against their shenanigans, yes, but work to subvert their nasty schemes with the oxygen of democracy. It will take time. Patience and determination comrades!

    • No disrespect comrade – but FUCK PATIENCE.
      I’m too old to say “Oh well, maybe in another five years” – but my not living to see a socialist government is unimportant.
      There are millions in desperate need of socialism right now, and possibly hundreds of thousands in mortal danger from another Tory government and a privatised NHS and DWP.

      We need a media that tells the truth NOW and the only feasible way to get that is retroactively to criminalise the subversion of democracy by media owners, editors and journalists who fill the electorate’s heads with Tory propaganda instead of news, and presently have nothing to fear from doing so. On the contrary, the most effective propagandists can expect elevation to the peerage, or at least a knighthood.

      • As I said in a post on here two or three weeks ago David, it should be a criminal offence to make vexatious and malicious claims about anti-semitism AND to allude to them – as with the infamous front-page headline in the three Jewish newspapers, and claiming the LP is institutionally racist, as Chuka Umunna did, for example – without citing evidence for your claim, INCLUDING of course the media. Needless to say, it is TOTALLY unacceptable that individuals such as Ken and Jackie and Chris etc can be smeared as such, and their lives turned upsidedown, and that a WHOLE section of a political party can be demonised in such a way. And I of course include the CAA and the LAA and JLM etc AND the EHRC!

        If you go on the Community Security Trust website, and hold the cursor over the section entitled Antisemitism and click on Prosecutions in the drop-down menu, it takes you to a page which lists all the convictions each year for anti-semitism. And as you will see, in 2018 there were 22 such convictions, and in 2017 there were 24. Anyway, I read through ALL of them a couple of nights ago (having just discovered the page), and not a single one of them was an LP member, and I have no doubt that THAT will be the case when I read through all the other prosecutions listed in the years before.

        Odd, isn’t it, how the CAA and the LAA and the JLM and Margaret Hodge et al come up with all theses thousands of claims of A/S between them, and yet they DON’T appear to report them to the police. Yes, it’s very odd that!

        And I should just add that the reason I went on the CST website is because I was looking for their stats regarding the amount of A/S incidents reported to them each year, which I came across two or three months ago. I’m not gonna start looking now, but I’m pretty certain that the figure for 2018 was 1,300 and something, and so the implication is that in the vast majority of reported cases, no individual (or individuals) is apprehended, which is surprising to say the least, given all the CCTV everywhere. I suppose it’s more than possible in the light of the ongoing ‘anti-semitism’ smear campaign against JC and the left, that more than a few of those TOO could be vexatious claims, so as to boost the numbers, and then blame JC and the left for the increased number of incidents!

        Here’s a direct link to the CST page I’m referring to:

        https://cst.org.uk/antisemitism/prosecutions

        PS Yes, I know you were speaking about the lies and falsehoods in general David, and vexatious claims of ANY nature should be regarded as a criminal offence of course, and dealt with harshly by the courts.

      • And talking of vexatious claims, I have to mention Kelvin Hopkins, who has been suspended now for two years as of next week. If you’re relatively new to skwawkbox and unfamiliar with the malicious nature of the claims – made some THREE years AFTER the claimed incidents supposedly happened – check out the statement he released through his solicitor on the day the ‘story’ hit the headlines And needless to say, most of the media conveniently ignored it (skwawkbox was in fact the very first to publish it), as Kelvin reproduces the texts he was sent by the woman – at the time the alleged incidents occurred – who made the claims – which he fortunately kept, and which blow her claims well and truely out of the water:

        https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15640737.kevin-hopkins-statement-in-full/

        And my apologies for so many posts!

      • Allan – your examination of the CST data is useful. Others have also examined aspects of it – and, again failed to substantiate the charges of ‘antisemitism’ within the Labour Party.

        The effectiveness of the lies and fabrications, however, can be seen when one talks with people who aren’t political nerds like those of us here. I find that such individuals don’t actually think a lot about the issue, but have absorbed the drip-drip-drip of false news, and are quite surprised – even shocked – when you enlighten them about the control and concerted falsification of the media narrative.

        As said earlier, the worst aspect is the way in which the Labour Party has effectively signed a confession, thus reinforcing the narrative.

      • RH: Who are the “others” you refer to who you say have looked at aspects of the CST data? And it does seem odd that they would be doing so… so as to try and substantiate the charges that there IS anti-semitism in the LP, as opposed to the opposite reason for doing so – ie in effect, finding evidence that it barely exists other than it does in society in general, and really isn’t an issue, as such, and has been blown out of all proportion by those who are intent on sabotaging JC’s leadership AND his chances of winning a GE and forming a government.

        Anyway, it’s good to hear you’re enlightening people who have been duped and deceived and taken in by all the propaganda lies and falsehoods (and no doubt you obviously told them WHY the smear campaign is happening and what the smearers objective is), and hopefully THEY, in turn, will enlighten others, and so on. I think one of the most effective ‘enlighteners’, is to inform people that only FOUR LP members have ever been prosecuted and found guilty of ant-semitism since JC was elected leader AND that the reason Ken Livingstone and Jackie Walker etc have never been reported to the police by any of the people condemning and vilifying them is because they didn’t say anything remotely anti-semitic and their accusers know it.

      • “Who are the “others” you refer to who you say have looked at aspects of the CST data?”

        I can’t remember the specifics, but it was one of the several reputable studies looking at the actuality and the available data. It pointed out that even the CST data did not, in actuality, support any notion of widespread antisemitism.

        Apart from that – what are you wittering about? You seem to have failed to get hold of anything resembling a stick – let alone the wrong end of it.

        I was actually endorsing what you said before you went off on a misdirected rant!

        Try a cold towel on the forehead.

      • David totaly agree we have all waited long enough for a true socialist Labour government…,like you my patiance and time is slipping away and far worse for the victims of these parasites that pretend to be a government..!

      • “FUCK PATIENCE….We need a media that tells the truth NOW”

        I totally agree with your sentiments, David. It’s not so much the imminence of falling of my perch, but the fact that our children (the oldest approaching 40) have *never*, in their lives, experienced a progressive, egalitarian government.

        The agenda for any such government is immense – and not least is the issue of creating a framework that at least *begins* to correct the corruption of the media by plutocratic interests.

        But there’s no short cuts. Crap tactics and strategy at this juncture won’t be compensated for by blind faith and ritual chants. There needs to be a collective hard head applied to get away from the pointless distraction of Brexit and the myth of it providing a route to a socialist paradise.

    • Polling people on their perception of the extent of AS and then citing that perception as evidence of AS is so obviously spurious it’s depressing how many fall for it.

      “But the AJC wants to be bipartisan” looked unpromising but “so it has to cook the evidence.” quickly corrected that impression.
      It’s great that JVL works so tirelessly to correct the MSM fake news, and the body of the piece would convince any impartial reader.
      There are simply too few readers.

      ‘News’ on antisemitism in the UK or on ‘Labour AS’ can’t be considered impartial or representative of the truth without mention of the low number of antisemitic incidents reported to CST.
      Without that context the MSM is indisputably spreading foul, fear-mongering propaganda – cowing innocent people to maintain a corrupt government in power.

      BBC ‘Crime Watch’ always ended with “Don’t have nightmares – sleep well.”
      BBC ‘Antisemitism Watch’ would end with “It’s EVERYWHERE! RUN FOR YOUR LIVES!!!”

      It’s despicable.

      Until the whole of the MSM is made to fear the consequences of telling lies that, by subverting democracy, commit treason – it seems to me we can only ever win occasional battles, never the war.
      Either the propagandising of ANY political party or sectional interest by the MSM must be criminalised or the dictionary definition of ‘democracy’ must be rewritten.

      • … and, to be blunt, it’s a tactic of the Israel Lobby and the Board of Deputies to scare the bejaysus out of any ordinary Jewish citizen by confecting fables about the nature of the threat.

        Nothing to do with the *actuality*.

  9. And on another topic…unpopular and in trouble centre right politician working with British centre right PM…Not Leo varadakar 1st minister of Ireland this time,but French president Macron.showing his personal loyalty to the banksters that control these 3global capatalist lackys .We need to back Corbyn more than ever with a General election slipping away and out of our hands.The tide has come in but it always goes out.!

  10. Your a fucking anti semite and a racist
    Sorry you feel that way
    Is all you need to know about why we are we are
    Bottom line is we have failed miserably to deal with Blairites and their attacks on JC, members and supporters
    Starting with vote on GE any MP failing to support the party line should have whip withdrawn and be replaced with a left wing candidate
    Move from what is currently a vicious circle to a progressive socialist virtuous circle
    FFS do something

    • Doug, when making quotes, it would be helpful if you put them in quotation marks otherwise people may thing you are directing the quote at them.

  11. Whe are all fighting for the Labour party and socialism because its the only choice available if you have any morality and Corbyn is the only choice and stuff the polls tha the fake pollsters produce to undermine our traditional voters.General election and trust the real peoples vote

  12. Allan, I commented a very long time ago on the CST numbers not supporting the contemporary assertions that AS in the UK or in Labour was increasing. I’d counted the prosecutions listed by CST in each of the preceding few years and it was in the low tens each year – no discernible trend.
    If WordPress search included comments instead of just SKWAWKBOX’s posts you’d have discovered that.
    Sometimes we forget the source of information that becomes part of our knowledge base. There’s no shame in it but by believing oneself immune to the phenomenon one can embarrass oneself.
    By ‘one’ I mean ‘you’ obviously.

    • ‘Allan, I commented a very long time ago on the CST numbers not supporting the contemporary assertions that AS in the UK or in Labour was increasing.’

      That’s great to hear David! But it’s always a good idea when you come across what is, in effect, incontrovertible evidence/proof that, on the one hand, there is no problem with A/S in the LP out of the ordinary AND, on the other, that it’s all a smear campaign, to draww peoples attention to it from time to time, as not everyone who reads and follows SB reads EVERY article, and there are of course also new people subscribing and discovering skwawkbox all the time.

      But please, pleeease, don’t feel any shame for not doing so. I mean it’s wonderful that people like yourself – and Richard (RH), for example – are on here every day, on practically every thread, sharing your knowledge and your wisdom and your thoughts with everyone, week in and week out, moth after month, in such a selfless way for the cause that is dear to all our hearts. So thankyou David for all you do do.

      • Allan – Was there really any need for you to sound so condescending.

  13. SteveH, thanks for the heads-up … I don’t read Allan’s longer comments when he’s off his med’s.
    If he keeps practising he might eventually manage sarcasm and not have it fall flat, but condescension is different.
    Condescension, unlike sex and sarcasm, requires that the fucker be higher up the food chain than the fucked.
    If I ever want to have condescension with Allan I’ll slap his arse first.

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