Momentum’s decision to push its own choice instead of unifying behind a slate has cost the left two seats on Labour’s NEC. Democracy in organising the left vote is essential
The loss of two seats on Labour’s National Executive Committee (NEC) to dire right-wing candidates today has exposed once and for all the inadequacy of the process – if it can be called that – for the selection of the left’s ‘slate’ of candidates in elections to Labour’s organisational bodies.
As the SKWAWKBOX warned, the failure of left organisations to agree a slate of candidates for the NEC has allowed woeful right-wingers to slip through to a victory the right’s numbers in the party do not merit.
Without the votes lost to Momentum’s insistence on pushing Leigh Drennan and CLPD consequently backing Cecile Wright, Jo Bird and Lauren Townsend would have won easily:
The process must now change – and it must do so quickly, in case the summer’s election of the full nine member representatives on the NEC proceeds in spite of the coronavirus crisis. If the by-election debacle is repeated, the chance to replace the two short-term right-wingers will be lost and turned into an even bigger loss.
The SKWAWKBOX is organising a democratic process for the selection, although this has been paused while the independent media focus on exposing the government’s appalling handling of the pandemic.
More information will follow as soon as appropriate.
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New True Labor party needed now
Maybe, just maybe given the somewhat mixed results of slavishly following the ‘left slate’ the membership have decided that they have had enough of being told how to vote and have decided to think for themselves.
Yes, and you’ll allow the right to act as they bastard well please in perpetuity, without so much as a by-your-leave, won’t you, steve?
You certainly seemed to know plenty about how the electorate would vote when you and your infallible 70% (or what have ya) allowed starmer to undemocratically renege on the party promise to respect the referendum result, didn’t you, brains?
You’re in NO position to make suggestions about organisation of any vote.
A policy commitment to voting is ‘undemocratic’.
Such is the empty Wolfie version of ‘socialism’ as an empty word on paper rather than a contended political objective.
Scottie! Beam him up!
and ” Thinked ” well and truly the wrong stupid way , as time will now demonstrate with a hammer blow to the very membership who somehow delusionally believe that they are going to have any say whatsoever on the future party policies .
rob – Unfortunately voting for the ‘left slate’ has not achieved very much apart from strengthening Lansman’s and McCluskey’s power base. The NEC still appears to act against rather than for the members.
As do you SH in voting for Starmer , another stupid move
The right were united – the left were not
Labour as a Socialist Party is now we’ll and truly dead.
I agree,and it a very sad day.It exposes the political ignorance of far too much of the membership.
I agree,and it a very sad day.It exposes the wilful political ignorance of far too much of the membership.
(Fixed it for ya!)
Let’s just imagine a changed reality – and change the electorate, of course – and all will be well!
As the story goes : “I went to our Jimmy’s passing out parade and, y’know, they were all out of step ‘cept him”
I suppose it depends on what we mean by Socialist. I don’t think LP has been a Socialist party for decades if it ever was one. I see it as a Social Democratic party… work within Capitalism/Imperialism to ameliorate worst effects but don’t fundamentally challenge the systems that produce such wealth and social inequality/fragmentation at home and brutal violence for plunder abroad. The system rewards those who support it, so politics is easily corrupted via modern majority self serving political class especially in this era of neoliberal mantras ‘there is no such thing as society’ and praise of ‘individuality’.
@ Maria , That I think is a very good resume of where Labour will now go under Starmer . Corbyn did at least start to try and steer it towards Democratic Socialism , but ultimately those ture to their cause and traitorous to a real Socialists Party won , but not by any fair or truthful means whatsoever.
I hope we get now a new DS party in the making and a home for the 400,000 who will be leaving Labour or being purged out over the next few yrs
Skwawkie doesn’t appear to have noticed, but the leadership issue has also been settled, with a *very* decisive swing to the right.
Although I have constantly advised members to ‘wait until conference’ before walking away, the sheer size of Starmer and Rayner’s majorities over left wing candidates indicates that it’s all over.
There’s no socialism there.
I have no intention of staying here and being a ‘left troll’, having suffered the boredom of ‘right trolls’ up to now, so its goodbye from me.
If there’s any socialists left here, I wish you well – I’m off to seek a party with socialism at its core.
(Yeah. I know. Wish me luck with that one.)
Another Left ‘Unity’? 😏
WTF’s THIS^^^
Triumphalism at someone leaving?
This has come from a ponce who has lorded it over me for his being a party member and me not being one.
Well this proves EXACTLY what you and your ilk are, steve.
As well as the broken EU ref promise, you were also warned about the mass exodus from the party if starmer was elected and now you’re even fucking GLOATING over it rather than persuading far more decent people than yourself to remain.
You complete gobshite.
Toffee – “WTF’s THIS^^^
Triumphalism at someone leaving?
No, I’m simply pointing out the rather obvious futility of the likes of Left ‘Unity’.
Oh, but OF COURSE it is. It even looks like it – complete with your smirking emoji.
Do us all a favour…
good luck with your new Tory lite party SH in not winning anything in the future , its on you head now mate as a big Starmer fan. Remember how utterly WRONG you got it over the Brxshit remain option , you got it wrong here again .
Well done in making Labour irrelevant and it’s now so easy to Join a party that is more relevant than Labour .
I see that 293K members just did not bother to vote for a leader such was the appalling choice on offer , and 393K didn’t bother for the Deputy Leadership.
So Starmer doesn’t exactly have a overwhelming mandate from the membership does he !
rob 04/04/2020 at 2:08 pm
Here’s a direct comparison between the results of Corbyn’s election in 2015 and Starmer’s victory today.
Member’s Votes
Corbyn – 121,751 – 49.6%
Starmer – 225,135 – 56.07%
Affiliate’s Votes
Corbyn – 41,217 – 57.6%
Starmer – 40,417 – 53.13%
Registered Supporters’ Votes
Corbyn – 88,449 – 83.8%
Starmer – 10,228 – 78.64%
I would argue that the membership have made their position very clear. The marginally lower turnout and support that you highlight from the unions pales into insignificance when compared with the full members votes where Keir attracted twice the number of votes and a significantly higher proportion of the vote than Jeremy did in 2016.
”I see that 293K members just did not bother to vote for a leader such was the appalling choice on offer , and 393K didn’t bother for the Deputy Leadership.
So Starmer doesn’t exactly have a overwhelming mandate from the membership does he !”
Way to go, rob!!
You reading this, steve?
https://memecrunch.com/meme/B0SZI/git-sum/image.gif
Rob
“I see that 293K members just did not bother to vote for a leader such was the appalling choice on offer , and 393K didn’t bother for the Deputy Leadership.”
Blimey, is that correct… I assume membership remains in the 500K region. Pretty damning for process, involvement/interest of membership in the party and quality of candidates involved.
Maria 04/04/2020 at 4:37 pm
The figures given above are in isolation quite misleading. Here are the full figures detailing the actual turnout for each part of the Labour Party’s electorate
Full Members 552,835 – turnout 401,564 – 72.64%
Registered Supporters 13,626 – turnout 13,006 – 95.45%
Affiliated Members 217,690 – turnout 76,161 – 34.99%
Overall Totals,
All Eligible Votes 784,151 – turnout 490,731 – 62.58%
SteveH haha ha ha just pathetic really pathetic
@ the figures you selectivity produce , now go and do the same exercise for his second election in 2016 with a much strengthened and more representative membership than in 2015.
Then there were in 2015 really fuck all new Corbyn supporters compared to those present in 2016 .
You’ll find he would have slaughtered Starmer not only with a larger % vote but also a much bigger turnout of membership actually voting .
Ohh here I’ll do it for you so at least there is some honesty, here are the figures ….
2015
Corbyn: 251,417
DidNotVote: 131,350
+/-: +120,067
2016
Corbyn: 313,209
DidNotVote: 146,188
+/-: +167,021
2020
DidNotVote: 293,420
Starmer: 275,780
+/-: -17,640
Note for a simpletons mind ,,, 313,209 is a bigger number than 275,780 and those who did not vote in the leadership election 293,420 is a bigger number than 146,188
Plus how many members were there in the party in 2015 compared to today SH .
Now stupid boy WHAT WERE YOU SAYING REGARDING A MANDATE . STARMER HAS NO MANDATE COMPARED TO CORBYNS and he never will !
Still enjoy your Tory Lite Party SH , I for one won’t be in it for much longer , just waiting till COnf to have my suspicions confirmed where he takes the Party to , and have already today joined Left Unity along with many others I suspect.But then good Socialist, like me leaving will no doubt make Liberals like you very happy , do I care , nope not really as Labour is not going anywhere near power under Starmer for the next 3 elections , but that’s on your head now along with all those who voted for him
Fair enough, Heenan. I hope you reconsider, but I completely understand your reasoning. Best of luck, squire.
I, however, will use my terminal breath to spit in the eye of champagne socialists & council estate snobs who are shameless and brainless enough to continue to pontificate even after all their constant balls-ups .
I’ll neither forgive, nor forget what these rodents have done.
NEVER.
Perhaps if you’d joined the party instead of bleating from the sidelines you would have been able to influence the outcome.
How could I – a single person – possibly influence any outcome when you and your right-wing syndicate of shithouses have it all boxed off?
You must think I’m stupid enough to actually PAY to fund your clique. Well the jokes on you sunshine
You’ve already told me that my opinion doesn’t matter. Now we know in EXACTLY what context, don’t we?
You’ve grassed yourself up AGAIN.
Helmet.
“SteveH 04/04/2020 at 1:28 pm · ·
Perhaps if you’d joined the party instead of bleating from the sidelines you would have been able to influence the outcome.”
Rofl!
I see a narrative being constructed… those of us who don’t “put their money where their mouth is” are responsible for LP being an establishment party with a peer of the realm at the head. In your dreams.
heenan73 I have fundamentally disagreed with some of your views in the past, but I ask you to stay & fight for Socialism in the Labour Party. Please stay.
@Heenan , if you do manage to find any then pse let us know I think you’ll get killed in the rush/stampede to join it .
Good luck mate I’ve just joined Left Unity ,,, yeh I know but there is little else to start with
……..& now we have an NEC & Party Leader that takes instruction from the British Board of Deputies. Any criticism of Israel will be silenced & the ‘Witch-Hunt’ intensified.
At least he didn’t declare himself to be a Zionist like the other 2 options.
SteveH, “At least he didn’t declare himself to be a Zionist like the other 2 options.”
Yes he did, he said he supports Zionism, please don’t be disingenuous.
He has also confirmed it in his acceptance speech welcoming back Zionist members. Notably, he didn’t welcome back Socialist members who have been victimised by the Party because he knows it would have discounted Zionists such as Berger and Ellman!
Jack – FFS, It was RLB along with Nandy who declared themselves to be Zionist and RLB compounded this further by clearly stating that she would welcome Luciana and Louise back into the party. RLB also clearly said that the Labour Party should pay compensation to the ex staffers who appeared in the infamous Panorama ‘documentary’. Unlike your fanciful conjectures these are verifiable facts.
SteveH. Your comment does you no credit. You know as well as anyone that Starmer said he supports Zionism. Not only that but he has just said he would welcome Jews back into the Labour Party.
Who do you think he was talking about? Was it those Jewish comrades who have been victimised and expelled because of their opposition to Zionism, or was it Zionists such as Beger and Ellman who did their best to destroy the Leadership of Jeremy Corbyn?
You may be right – the battle has scarcely begun. And it’s going to be a long one.
… but that’s why RLB, as Lansman’s sidekick – was no choice at all.
You’ve got to have a defined ‘Left’ before you can define a ‘Left Slate’.
One thing is for sure – sitting on your arse, getting things wrong and just whining when things don’t pan out, isn’t a definition of ‘Left’ – except in Monty Python terms.
What did we on the left get wrong, dicky?
The actions that led to the election result?
Err, nope. YOU were warned about what’d happen, and it happened.
But I guess when the grand plan was to get shut of any trace of socialism within the party (especially within the hierarchy, but not exclusive to, as we shall see when the membership numbers start dropping) once and for all then you WERE right, eventually.
Toffee – Surely if you and your ‘many’ like minded comrades had all joined the party and had a vote you would have been able to influence the outcome. I guess liberally throwing around profanities from the sidelines is far easier than actually getting involved.
”Surely if you and your ‘many’ like minded comrades had all joined the party and had a vote you would have been able to influence the outcome.”
Do you think I’m a retard? Are YOU a retard?
Many ‘like-minded comrades’ DID join. The party became the biggest in Europe under Corbyn’s stewardship…
And the embedded right STILL rigged everything they could get away with in their favour.
And they’ll continue to do so.
“What did we on the left get wrong, dicky?”
Wel – for a start – the description of ‘we on the left’ after supporting the main plank (appropriate word) of Tory policy embodied in Brexitoryism. The current reluctance to raise questions about current Tory interpretation of the Covid-19 outbreak is all too familiar.
Antagonism to the Labour Party and a preference for calling everyone who doesn’t share a narrow fringe spectrum of views a ‘Tory’ is another symptom of the same sort of dubious political literacy. It added to the overt Tory propaganda campaign.
Of course, the same sort of dodgy definition led – naturally – to blaming election defeat on the too late adoption by the Party of a sensible and democratic alternative rather than a confused policy on Europe – in line with the wishes of the Party, and then imagining a swathe of SunMail Tories as essentially Labour supporters whilst slagging off the *actual* membership and support (the much hasn’t changed, either)!
We then saw a flag-waving rush to a general election at a time when a smidgen of political nous knew that such timing was lethal. A chance of victory was dead at that point.
The rest is history …. and the key question is what did this Toytown version of ‘left’ get ‘right’ (apart from the thrust of its essential politics)?
Perhaps you would be good enough to define it for us,you being so clever an all.
If there is one thing Corbyn’s leadership has shown, it is no matter how many Socialist members the LP has, even if there is a Socialist Leader, if there is not also a Socialist ‘management’, Socialism will always be defeated.
Why, because at its heart, the LP is controlled by the Israel Lobby as confirmed by Starmer’s acceptance speech, and Zionism, which is incompatible with Socialism, is the root driving force behind the Israel Lobby.
There are some on this blog and in the Party, who need to learn this lesson and until they do we will NEVER have a Socialist government.
I wondered how long it’d be…^^^
https://youtu.be/g9oRWKeKzC8
”Why, because at its heart, the LP is controlled by the Israel Lobby as confirmed by Starmer’s acceptance speech, and Zionism, which is incompatible with Socialism, is the root driving force behind the Israel Lobby.”
WHY are you complaining about starmer’s zionism?
YOU allowed him to manoeuvre to oust Corbyn and get himself installed as leader when it suited your pro-EU stance.
You wanted him, and YOU got him, jack.
Deal with it.
You are one of those Zionist appologists to whom I referred. Your trolling as a supposed Socialist fools no one. It wasn’t Brexit and your fanaticism for it which beat Corbyn, it was the Israel Lobby, which you constantly defend, which did the damage.
https://sputniknews.com/columnists/202004021078808440-how-friends-of-israel-destroyed-jeremy-corbyn-and-his-democratic-socialist-project/#comments
Again with the same tired old MO.
Put jack straight on his hypocrisy – get accused of being a zionist.
How many votes did antisemitism lose compared to the 2nd referendum, jack?
1%?
2%?
3% maybe?
Nobody was arsed about antisemitism, it was waaaay down on people’s lists, you complete and total gawp.
With your constant screaming about it, YOU brought it to the attention of the public EVERY BIT AS MUCH as hodge, mann and the rest of the lying shithouses did,
Now go away and think about what you’ve done for the country. Go on, Sod off.
Oh, and jack? Show me ONE post where I’ve allegedly ‘defended’ the israeli lobby.
Go on….You show everyone on here just ONE post where I’ve defended israel, or hodge, or mann or screeching, or anybody/thing else, over Corbyn.
THEN you can call me a zionist.
Just ONE post…
Off you pop.
So Toffee, the next time if there ever is one, that we have a Socialist spokesperson who criticises Israel’s ethnic cleansing and is hounded out of the Party for it but there is no issue such as Brexit for you to turn to for blame, what will you do?
Chris Williamson supported Brexit but he fell victim to the Zionists no matter how hard he fought against them. Brexit certainly wasn’t the reason for his victimisation. It was Zionism deep within the bureacracy which was responsible but you are just too thick to recognise it.
Where s the post of me defending israel over Corbyn, jack?
Find one, or retract the zionist slander.
Toffee, don’t put on the ‘I’m so hurt’ garbage.
Anytime I have pointed to Zionism as a major cause for disunity and strife within the Party, of which it is noticeable that you are not a member, you have tried to deflect attention away from it.
So take your sulky self pity and stick it!
Hurt? By you?
L.O.L.
L.O.L again.
*Catches breath*
L.O.L. AGAIN.
Christ! But you’ve an astronomically over-inflated opinion of yourself, jack. Nobody, but NOBODY of such sparse intelligence could ever hope to put a dent in my feelings, sunshine – least of all you.
I’ll make it easy enough so even someone with your pitifully low quotient can understand it.
If you’re gonna start accusing me of something, back it up with evidence.
If you can’t, you must retract it .
Now, you can either show us evidence, or you’ll add making a liar to having had already made an idiot of yourself.
Oh, and here’s another clue…Not being a labour party member does NOT equate to zionism.
I’d suggest you try another angle, but you’d only get that wrong, too.
And you realise the biggest irony of your obsession with the EU and zionism, jack?
You allowed starmer to manoeuvre to get the leadership with the eu stance, and now he’s the leader he’s coming after YOU because of your overbearing obsession with zionist influence.
Oh sure, you got your 2nd ref with remain option. You didn’t get us a labour Govt though. A labour government that would’ve had massively more influence over israel & palestine than it ever would have in opposition.
But you WERE warned what’d happen…
And now starmer’s gonna allow the israeli lobby free reign. How did that happen, again? Oh, that’s right – I’ve already explained how in my second sentence of this post.
Yep, israel’s got it’s claws ALL OVER the party now, and YOU facilitated it with your pro-eu stance.
And you’re gonna be shrieking about it ever louder, which will bring MORE attention to yourself.
It’ll come to pass that pretty soon neither of us will be party members. But I’ll have left the party (late ’94) with an unblemished character, whereas YOU will be labelled an antisemite.
And you – of all people – KNOW how shit like that sticks.
Toffee, :- 🙂 Wow, sorry, I can’t help laughing at your rant to say how much you are not hurt 🙂 🙂 🙂
Well, tiny things amuse tiny minds, I guess.
…And with one as tiny as yours you’d be hard pressed to amuse anyone. 🙂
Toffee, ah playground responses are now your only recourse, I’ll leave you alone now you’ve reached that pathetic level.
Comrade Jack T & Comrade Toffee……..it deeply saddens me that 2 people of integrity & sincerely held beliefs cannot find the civility & humour, to address each other in a more comradely way.
Swapping insults resolves nothing & you both have so much to say that is worth listening to. We share more than that which divides us..
Wake up & smell the arabica, jack.
I’m not the one gonna get hoisted by my own pet hate…sorry, petard.
Mind you, with all the socialists that’ll be leaving the party off their own bat, I guess you getting punted in the most ironic fashion known to mankind will go towards evening up the numbers in it’s own small way.
I hear the lib dims are pro european, jack. But with the antisemite label you’ll be lumbered with if you hang around long enough for the zionists within labour party to pin on you before you’re booted out; it’s doubtful even the lib dims will accept you.
And, to think they accepted chukka umunna with open arms…
@steve richards
I have done my level best, time after time after time, to enlighten jack, and warn him about the error of his ways.
I invariably get it thrown back in my face, even when I’ve been consistently proved right.
The saying is true: You simply cannot educate pork.
I have NOTHING in common with jack t, or his ilk, I’m afraid.
Steve Richards, I’m sorry to say, your intervention is unhelpful.
You obviously do not realise that Toffee has tried to deflect blame from the very group which has done most to damage Jeremy Corbyn. Leaving aside Toffee’s fanaticism for Brexit which I know you support and which is maybe why you have failed to recognise the background, I honestly thought that you had a little more perception about his motives for being here.
Apart from the occaisional well aimed barb at Toffee, I think you’ll find I have been more than reserved in my responses, as opposed to his foul and abusive language to anyone who disagrees with his views.
I have to say I agree with you on that Jack T , for such a small country Israel has sure as hell punched above its weight politically .Mind you it does help having the USA on your side too.
But yes in essence I do now believe that Labour as it is under Starmer will become a 100% poodle of the Israeli lobby. I feel so sorry for the poor Palestinians who once again have lost .
And I take specific note of Starmers statement if my memory serves me right , that he will ” rip out AS in the Labour party by its roots ”
Well if that doesn’t scream witch hunt of the Left Socialists , nothing else will and I feel very concerned for our good friends and supporters in the JVL .
The more I think about it , the more convinced I am becoming a new party is the only way forward and that would include the JVL . Maybe they might actually start it off !
Should we trust the numbers
Tim – Apart from you not being happy with these undeniably decisive results (sour grapes) have you any reason to doubt their veracity. .
Oh, and there was me being told that those that didnt vote in the referendum were remainers…
As & when it suits, eh?
Toffee – Not by me.
Dafuq are you on about?
‘Not by me’??
You were THE biggest protagonist of the: ‘It was unfair and undemocratic’ whinge from the remain side, for complete fuck’s sake.
You’re the one perpetually whining about the percentage that DIDN’T vote, which somehow made the result invalid.
So don’t try to palm us off with that shite, mister.
The Toffee (597) 04/04/2020 at 3:22 pm · ·
You’re the one perpetually whining about the percentage that DIDN’T vote, which somehow made the result invalid.
No I’m not, you must be confusing me with someone else. You are more than welcome to try proving otherwise with direct quotes and links. Please don’t waste my time, or yours, with endless ranting.
yes , get your head out of your arse , there are already reports coming in from members not getting their postal voting cards , something stinks already
@Tim , NO absolutely not , there are right now reports on members Twitter feeds of them not getting their votes through , something stinks already , so NO I don’t trust the numbers
“Decorbynisation cannot be a trim job; the diseased roots must be hacked out. As well as reforming the complaints process along the lines proposed by Lisa Nandy, Labour will have to rid itself of the fallen redeemer and his sullen apostles. Expel him. Expel everyone who nominated him. Expel everyone who voted for him. Burn it down and salt the earth. Failing that, whoever follows Corbyn must make Labour such a hostile environment for Corbynism that as many of his ideologues as possible tear up their membership cards. Rehabilitate those who can be, allow space for reflection and genuine remorse, but drive the rest out without delay. If the next leader will not at least do that, he or she may as well stick Corbyn in their shadow cabinet because he will belong there”
These combative words are there to challenge us. Let’s not make it too easy for them
“As for the man himself (Jeremy Corbyn), he should know that his attempts to manufacture a respectable legacy will go nowhere. You made Jews afraid of the Labour party; there is no coming back from that. Those of us who tried to warn people about you from the start take no pleasure in having been vindicated because a great many suffered along the way. There is no redeeming moral to this story. The far-left never takes responsibility for its failures; every defeat recedes into the bitter mythos of betrayal. You won’t be back but your like will be and one day we’ll go through this dreary fanaticism all over again. So the least you can do is spare us the longest retirement speech in history. Take your messiah complex and your dismal little cult and shove off.”
I shove off for no one. Not even Tony Blair or a nobody like Stephen Daisley, the author of the above words.
I am eagerly awaiting the triumphalism of the right to burn itself out. Then, like Jeremy Corbyn, “I’ll be out there campaigning for socialism, peace and justice, and I feel sure we’ll be doing that together”, (J Corbyn).
Let’s all stay in Labour and stay true to Jeremy – at least until we see what Sir K plans for his party and people. Jeremy needs us to stay true to his project for Labour.
They lie with surprising ease…
ITs a shame but the writing has been on the wall for a long time.The country voted Tory and the Labour party was boosted by a massive influx when Corbyn decided to stand down.Approx sixty thousand new right wing members of the right.I predict that the Exodus will leave the Labour party with one hundred thousand moderates and the party has decided that a milder but just as dangerous neo liberal ideology is for them.I hope that the establishment politics suits you Sir knightly Starmer and all who sale in the sinking ship.Good luck and bon voyage Fools errend to oblivion….Shame all that for nothing.
Joseph, I hope that you are not saying that the right wing are moderates! There is no one who is more moderate than Jeremy Coybyn, to be on the left is not to be ‘not moderate’. Please don’t fall into Skwawky’s trap of calling anyone on the left who supported ‘Remain’ as Centrists or Moderates. It was one of the causes for splits in the Party.
I’ll just leave this here in case you missed it last time, jack.
https://skwawkbox.org/2020/04/04/nec-result-shows-the-left-cannot-allow-old-structures-to-continue-to-fight-over-candidates/#comment-141301
Jack T….moderate fanatics then,but it really doesnt matter anymore with a membership thats not embarrassed in electing a knight of the realm…..Imagine PMs questions every time the hypocrite Sir keir strimmer stands up,the ridicule will be deafining in the massed hypocrisy of a party that could elect such a sly crook….Gone with the wind?
Comrade Jack T. It saddens me that that you prefer to denigrate an individual rather than indulge in constructive debate. Chris Williamson is cynical about EU membership, but I wonder how quickly you would ever question his perception, least of all to his face.
I too voted Brexit for reasons that you don’t want to understand, but now you have a leader who shares your obsession with Remain. Happy Jack!
Blessed are the Peacemakers Comrade!
There is a myth that the democratic socialist Labour Party was split. As Richard Burgeon said it was the PLP that was split from the majority of the party. Evidence, the Chicken coup, the constant attacks from Mann, Leslie Hodge, Phillip et al. Not forgetting of course the Labour peers { Kinnock et al) who rebelled against the overwhelmingly democratically elected leader of the democratic socialist Labour Party. The party shall follow on a right wing trajectory led by a knight of the realm who is a member of an organisation funded and founded by a right wing American billionaire who has no notion of democracy. Naturally, Starmer will not disclose his secret financial backers and it’s not difficult to fathom why.
Steve Richards, please don’t try and make yourself out to be one of the ‘good guys’ your obsession with Brexit clouds your perception to such an extent that you will even defend someone, as long as they too support your obsession, who has obviously tried to take the attention away from the very group who are in the Labour Party to make sure that a true Socialist never becomes PM. YOUR Brexit obsession overides everything else.
As for your comment about Chris Williamson, even though I profoundly disagree with his views on Brexit and your snide comment that I wouldn’t say it to his face, I have indeed told him directly. However, I do not let my Remain view overide my overall view and I support Chris up to the hilt, indeed I am cooperating with him on a forthcoming project.
Oh, and seeing as how Jo Bird didn’t make it onto the NEC, your party membership’s in even more jeopardy, wouldn’t you agree, jack?
Oh, you can protest all you like that you’re not antisemitic,soft ollies, but it didn’t do Chris Williamson, Marc Wallace or even Jackie Walker any good – even though it was patently obvious they weren’t.
The writing’s on the wall for your membership, I’m afraid, jack.
*Marc Wadsworth, (I beg your pardon)
FFS! It wasn’t Brexit and it wasn’t just the antisemitism lies that did for Labour.
It was control of the narrative by a totally one-sided media, aided by a hostile PLP legacy, plus some basic inexperience and incompetence in the difficult task of countering those forces.
Pointless onanism about the Brexit ‘betrayal’ delusion is just perpetuating the failure. It’s just that the Tories put one over.
… as they are still doing.
Nope sorry but it was Brexit and the hijacking of Corbyn by Starmers remain option that did it for us . It was proved again and again on the doorstep canvassing conversations and the killer punch is the only difference between 2017 and 2019 was the remain option on the ballot.
You just have to accept the facts RH .
But no matter Labour is now finished as a Socialist party and the RW Centrists can rejoice at their irrelevance for the next decade or two , as Govt will not come to Labour whilst under their control , mind you that’ll suit many PLP MPs who never wanted to be in power as it’s too difficult and too much responsibility , and they just love having their snouts in the trough for doing fuck all
We’re all doomed FFS
Read the article again, the numbers are there to repair damage when full NEC election takes place
If this is a red Tory victory then the ruthless bastards will start the clear out very quickly
The left needs to be just as ruthless, but pointless if we give up or cannot agree on who represents us
Shouldn’t take long to find out if we are pissing in the wind again, then accept it’s time to take the gloves off
I have to say that my decision not to vote has been borne out in the case of both Lansman’s little helper and Starmer’s reluctance to tackle the Israel Lobby (Nandy was never an issue).
There’s a mountain to climb to achieve the necessary honesty- but it needs to be remembered that the dishonesty started under Corbyn’s leadership, with the adoption of the IHRA garbage and the expulsion of good anti-racists. There’s actually no change in the subservient posture.
The failure to elect Jo Bird is sad.
But there’s no point in abandoning Labour. If I go, it’ll be because I’m slung out, not because I’m throwing a paddy over a sensible referendum proposal.
“Throwing a Paddy” Casual racism with a small dose of religious bigotry…..we have people like you in the majority again inside the Labour party.Would you insult a jew or a moslem in such a way.ITs casual and people like me suffered that insult for many years,till I left the country after a less than casual attack on my family by the more extreme version in direct action physically.RH shame on you.
From the moment that JC came within 2,000 votes of winning the 2017 GE, the ruling classes have dedicated every ounce of their fibre to destroying an alternative to the market knows best ideology.
Witness, how the MSM, along with the State Broadcaster, the security services, the affiliated Tory organisations plus the right wing malcontents worked on a war of attrition to eradicating a mild threat to their power, prestige and privileges.
The writing was on the wall for me when I attended a CLP meeting with John Mc Donald as the guest speaker followed by Liam Byrne who McDonald was supporting as a West Midlands candidate for some obscure office. He refused to address a legitimate question from a member who asked what is your response to the Labour peers that refused to recognise JC as leader of the party.
Instead of supporting JC he sidestepped the issue by stating he would abolish the House of Lords. In addition, he kept repeating the mantra of unity without realising consciously that people like Byrne, Brown, Blair and ultimately Starmer only want unity on their terms.
It’s not difficult to follow what will happen next to Labour Party that is led by a man who bullied the Swedish authorities to continue with their fabricated charges against the political prisoner Julian Assange!
No Deal + Covid 19 = Depression era numbers out of work and Austerity on steroids
Tory snouts in trough should finish them off
JC legacy should be 1945 style backlash,
Can we make sure the fuckers never get in again
To change the country once and for all
Thats not a job for Centrists
Unfortunately for us we have a Centrists wet dream as a Leader so unlikely we will get the chance to change anything
rob
Oppositions don’t win GE’s governments lose them
No Deal is taking the piss
Keir does not have the luxury now of undermining JC
Its put up or shut up
The boot is on the other foot, members will expect manifesto to be honoured and debate over Remain is over
Cant think of much he can change except PLP arse lickers
Just seen this tweet from the awful Hodge woman. I am lost for adjectives to sum up the arrogant, mendacious hypocrisy of this tweet.
“Warm congratulations to
@Keir_Starmer
! At last the failed Corbyn project is over. Under Keir’s leadership I am hopeful we can begin the journey to rebuild Labour into a trusted, tolerant & truly radical government in waiting.”
https://twitter.com/margarethodge/status/1246375537876049920
I would laugh if it didn’t sum up the kind and quality of fictitious messaging I suspect is about to start spewing from LP.
What a horrible bastard she is. We need open selection to get rid of trash like that.
Unfortunately, the gobshites of barking voted to save it’s scrawny neck.
Strangely, I’ve never heard steve h, rh, or jack t telling us to respect THAT particular result…But then again I haven’t seen them disagree with it or question it’s validity, neither.
Tolerant of WHAT, hodge? Paedophilia? Time wasting and damaging false accusations of antisemitism? £££Millions stashed in offshore accounts?
GTF hodge you contumelious owld c**t.
And to think this virus of neoliberal rebirth happened under a left wing leader who was just too nice and decent to be mixed up in a dogfight with the enemy within.We just didnt realise that the membership and the country do not support Socialism as the only solution to a failed ideology of the right world wide.Now because we were “Nice” the country will like the Labour party will be on a downward spiral and god knows were it will
end with both the government and the supposed opposition in agreement ideologically..How many more years of Austerity and Euthanasia for the vunarable thanks to the Labour party membership,that we mistakenly thought of as socialist and loyal.Just shows how deluded we all were
Joseph – Baring in mind that the overwhelming majority of the party wouldn’t agree with you.are you honestly advocating that RLB would have offered a better alternative.
In my book YES by a country mile , at least she advocated for Open selection , remember that one SteveH … your passion and favourite “want” or must have . Funny how quickly you have changed your tune to suit your Starmer choice .
No principles and a nobody … suits you .
My litmus test of fitness to lead is the response to the JLM/BoD propaganda campaign.
There is absolutely no substantial difference between Starmer and RLB in this area where there is a risk in what you say – as opposed to empty sentiment pitched at specific electoral groups.
SteveH 04/04/2020 at 9:51 pm · ·
The Toffee (597) 04/04/2020 at 3:22 pm · ·
You’re the one perpetually whining about the percentage that DIDN’T vote, which somehow made the result invalid.
No I’m not, you must be confusing me with someone else. You are more than welcome to try proving otherwise with direct quotes and links. Please don’t waste my time, or yours, with endless ranting.
Ok, if I find one of your posts that relates to you going on about the amount of people what didn’t vote in the referendum, will you leave this site NEVER to return?
No use moaning about what’s happened. Most socialists who joined the LP did so because we saw an opportunity to further policies that would benefit the majority of the population.
I never expected an easy ride. I expected the betrayals by those already in power and by those who want power. I expected the media to support ‘sensible’ candidates. I expected the lies and back stabbing from the new set of luvvies, mainly based around Lansman as they realised that by playing the game it would gain them status and financial reward.
I knew from experience how rules would be used as tools of discrimination. I expected the snobbery from the people who regard themselves as the ‘professional; class’ who think they have a god-given right to be in control. It must have been quite perturbing for them to have to sit with people who don’t wear a suit when at work. It’s a class thing.
I was already aware that the same individuals like to pretend that they’re socialists, talk the talk, but always fail abysmally when it comes to an integral component of socialism; democracy. Like I keep saying, these creatures can’t abide being in a minority, hence the witch-hunt.
I can well understand why many members will leave the LP as it’s not a nice place to be, especially for the uninitiated to the murky world of politics.
At the moment there’s still a good contingent in the LP of honest people who support the ideas of public ownership, the cornerstone of socialism. Funny how this has now also become the favourite policy of the Financial Times and the World Bank! 🙂
I suspect the fast tracking of career minded individuals into bureaucratic positions will increase. Though we’ve seen this trend already despite Corbyns leadership, of appointing people into well paid positions. Appointing, not electing; often no interview process, just slotting in ‘their people’. Kerching.
I expect only lip service from the leadership to the ideals of public ownership. I expect the LP to move further to the Tories. The openly Stalinist nature of Lansman and McCluskey should give the game away, the latter of these millionaires openly praising Stalin at a so called Left meeting recently. Candidates standing for democracy against McCluskies preferred people are called ‘extremists’; language of Tories and fascists I think.
So, like I said some time ago, we should be having the discussion about what our response should be. The LP nationally will lose support among the electorate as it becomes more ‘kinder and gentler’ instead of attacking the Tories ruthlessly at every opportunity for their appalling attitudes and policies. We’ll see the growth of fascist organisations too as they’ll see fertile ground for their smoke and mirrors routine. We need to start discussing where we go from here; lets get organised.